November 13, 2022
Fullerton Community & Economic Development Department
Re: Short Term Rental Application for 1850 Edgecliff Dr Ref# STR-2022-0036
I’m writing in response to the letter I received regarding a Short-Term Rental Application for 1850 Edgecliff Dr. Ref # STR-2022-0036.
I am vehemently against approving this application.
This is my second time submitting this letter. The first time was in September under STR-2022-0028. I share this because some of what is written below references my initial submission, regardless, the facts haven’t changed. The home owners at 1850 Edgecliff Dr are irresponsible and disrespectful and should not be permitted to disrupt my peace and quiet with renters at their home.
The owners at 1850 Edgecliff Dr have been using their home as an Airbnb rental for several months now. I’ve personally seen the ad posted on the Airbnb website. And, there is a renter occupying a portion of their home as I type this response (Sept 19). I know this because we had a very alarming incident with the renters this past Saturday night, Sept 17, that should have resulted in another call to the Police Department. Fullerton PD were not called because the partygoers looked liked gangbangers and I was fearful of retaliation. Renters held a party in their backyard. I witnessed up to 12+ males and females in the backyard through my fence. Males were dressed in very baggy pants and oversized flannels. They were smoking marijuana on several occasions throughout the party in addition to playing very loud music. You could see a cloud of smoke above the party in addition to smelling the marijuana each time they smoked. There were cars regularly dropping off and picking up teens (I estimate 17-19 years old) throughout the night from approximately 19:00hrs until the owners came home. The owners came home at approximately 22:45hrs and broke up the party. Although the party was broke up at 22:45 hrs, these kids were still on our street past midnight which made me feel very unsafe and uncomfortable. I shouldn’t feel this way in my own home.
There are numerous reasons why you should NOT approve this application. Below is a high-level recap. A more detailed explanation of items can be found after the below recap:
Fullerton Police - FPD have been called to 1850 Edgecliff Dr on 4 separate occasions since they purchased this home approximately 20 months ago. To my knowledge, twice for their sons and twice for a party they hosted with a live DJ and very loud music in their backyard after 22:00hrs (on a Thursday night). 4 FPD calls in 20 months should be reason alone to deny this application. Ive lived on Edgecliff Dr for 4 years and never saw a police car on our street until they moved in and now it feels normal.
Parties - in the past several months, they’ve had several large parties that have led up to me calling the Fullerton Police. After the first two large parties, neighbors have shared with them that their parties are too large and too loud. They are disruptive to the neighborhood. Then they planned their party on August 11, a Thursday night. After they were told we will not tolerate another excessively loud party, especially on a Thursday night, they had the party regardless.
On July 26, 2022 at 5pm another party with teenagers in their backyard blasting music. I can hear music in my house with all windows and doors closed. Due to their party, the street was filled with cars parked up and down Edgecliff, some double-parked.
They continue to show a complete lack of respect to the neighborhood as well as the rules that we are required to live by. They don’t think rules apply to them. They have demonstrated this on numerous occasions.
Parking - The homeowners rarely park their vehicles in their driveway. FPD and Code Enforcement have been notified of the overnight parking violations on several occasions. Citations have been issued for the overnight parking on the street. Regardless, they continue to park on the street overnight because they think rules don’t pertain to them. Furthermore, they have 4 vehicles so i don’t even think they have the proper room to keep all their vehicles plus potential short term renters vehicles from parking on the street overnight.
Dog - Their German Shepherd is an absolute nuisance (their fault, not the dogs fault). The dog barks constantly. A complaint was filed with the barking dog complaint department in August 2022. The dog has escaped from their backyard on numerous occasions, I’d estimate over 25 times. I have captured video of the dog loose on my property at least 10+ times. The dog has escaped and attacked people walking by on Edgecliff Dr. One occasion was reported to county and they were required to fill out a corrective action report, one time it went after a young kid walking with his father and one time it went after a young family walking their baby and small dog where it had the small dog in its mouth (I have this attack on audio from my doorbell camera). They have failed to demonstrate any sort of concern to secure their dog appropriately. If they can’t fix the problem of the dog escaping, how can we expect they’d fix any issues with renters when those issues arise. When they were confronted about the excessive and incessant dog barking, her response was, its not my dog, it belongs to my son, call the city to report it. As the homeowner, they take no responsibility and they will have the same titled about renters should you approve this permit.
Safety First - Their teenage kids do not operate their vehicles in a safe manner on our street. One son is constantly racing up and down the street in his BMW. I have video of this from my doorbell camera. Their inability to correct these unsafe actions shows that they will not correct issues with future rental tenants
Noise - This is my largest concern with this neighbor. It has been constant issues since they moved in, Jan 2021. It started with the nonstop construction noice, the nonstop constant dog barking, blasting the outdoor stereo they have in their backyard (its rarely ever at a reasonable level, mostly played at its highest level), pool equipment has had issues 3 separate occasions over a 3 month timeframe where the pool equipment emitted a very loud humming noise (I have audio proof), however the issue here is their lack of concern getting it repaired, incredibly loud mufflers (sounds like a bomb going off) on their Mercedes and white BMW, and lastly, the outdoor backyard parties with the DJ and music heard throughout the neighborhood. These concerns have been brought to their attention but they don’t get resolved which leads me to believe nor will issues with renters. We have enough issues with them, why add more issues by approving a permit to add renters?
Trash - Trash has been kept on their driveway outside of trash cans and on the street prior to trash day and past trash day. They’ve placed a pile of trash on the street for weeks at a time making the street look terrible and dirty. They also regularly keep their trash cans on the street days past trash day. The week of August 7th, trash day was on the 8th and trash cans were left outside until Thursday, August 11th. Trash bags are also left on the side of their house which attract rodents (have photos). Ive asked them to stop that practice but they left the trash there and ignored my request. Should you approve the STR permit, now this trash issue will get even worse. If they can’t abide by the rules without renters, why would anyone want to increase the issues with the trash? On October 23, they left multiple large mattresses along with other items literally on the street. Photos attached. The city was OB into even scheduled to pick the items up until Thursday, Oct 27Th. Another example of this home owner who has no respect for the neighborhood by leaving these items on the street 4 days prior to their scheduled pickup.
I chose to buy my house specifically in the area I am for several reasons, but most importantly, its an established mature area that has virtually no crime and it’s a quiet neighborhood. Home owners in our neighborhood generally take care of their homes and the neighborhood. One of the more important reasons I purchased my home on Edgecliff Dr is that it’s a quiet neighborhood. That is no longer the case. These neighbors at 1850 Edgecliff Dr have changed that. Our neighborhood is no longer peaceful and no longer quiet. The numerous issues I’ve listed are a decent representation of what the past 20 have been like to live on Edgecliff Dr. You may not be aware but there are only 6 homes on our small street. We don’t need or want a “hotel” on our tiny street. Additionally, Im very concerned with the value of my home knowing that there could be a “hotel” next to my house. How will this effect my home value? How will it effect my ability to sell my house? I don’t think anyone would dispute it would negatively effect both my home value and ability to sell. Who’s responsible for that?
While I recognize the intent of this letter is not going to put my street back to the way it was, I’m writing this letter so it doesn’t get any worse than it is now. My experience with my neighbors is such that when they are given an inch, they will take several feet. I’ve tried my best to establish the fact that they do not follow rules. It may start with a couple renters in a bedroom or two, but it will increase and they will break rules and I expect the whole will be rented. You may think that you can stop that, and maybe you can, but Im going to have to suffer through it until you are ready to stop it. Allowing an Airbnb short term rental will only exasperate the problems we already have. I can confidently say that because my neighbor at 1850 Edgecliff Dr has clearly shown a lack of interest in correcting any issues brought to their attention. They have a very simple attitude, “not my problem” and “not my rule”. They take ZERO responsibility. ZERO.
This past summer, I strongly believe they were operating an event planning business hosting parties in their backyard for profit. I share this because their backyard should not be used for commercial use at the expense of me and the other neighbors. We live in a residential area and paid party events that disrupt the neighborhood and keep neighbors up are disrespectful and not allowed. The fact that this neighbor held event parties in their backyard with loud outdoor music and DJs clearly shows they have a “I don’t care” attitude. Rules for thee, not for me. This behavior has established that they should not be rewarded with a STR permit. They do not follow rules.
They had large outdoor backyard parties on June 4, 2022, then another party on June 11th. The June 11 party had their DJ and music blasting outside until midnight. Young adults were hanging outside on our street until almost 2am. Days after the party, these neighbors were spoken to by my other neighbor who explained that they can’t have parties like the one they just had with loud music as it is not fair to the neighbors. He explained to them that someone is going to call the Police. July 26 they had music blasting outside for a kids party. Then on August 11th, it was the straw that broke the camels back. In fear I was going to ruin her party by calling the police, the neighbor text me 2-weeks prior advising she was having another party on Aug 11. I responded that quiet time in Fullerton started at 10pm, plus this was a Thursday night and I had work the next morning. She responded that she will do her best but her party didn’t start until 8pm. I responded that parties that start at 8pm do not finish at 10pm. The night of the party, there were 40-50 cars parked throughout our neighborhood, every spot on Edgecliff Dr, down Kroeger Ave and Raymond Ave. The party was very loud, I could clearly hear the music in my house with all windows and doors closed. Various groups of kids were hanging out on the street, taking the party into the streets. At 22:03, there was no sign of the party quieting down so the first time in my 52 years of existence, I called the Police. I should not be forced to stay up because they choose to not follow Fullerton’s rule that quiet time starts at 22:00 hrs. They are very aware (I’ve reminded them as have my other neighbor SEVERAL times) of the rule that quiet time is 22:00 hrs, yet they simply do not care, once again showing that rules do not apply to them. You cannot consciously throw a party for 100+ people that starts at 8pm, hire a DJ and outdoor music system, and expect it to finish at 10pm. They clearly held this party with zero care or concern for anyone in the neighborhood, including me. How can the City of Fullerton award them a STR permit knowing their history throwing parties?
The ongoing issue with their dog clearly shows their inability to correct an issue. Below is a handful of dates Ive documented when their dog escaped and ran loose in the neighborhood terrorizing people. I am not exaggerating when i use the word terrorize. Multiple dog attacks occurred. Notations to “video” below indicate I have a video of the their dog loose I can share as proof if needed. Doesn’t all these incidents demonstrate their inability to correct an issue?
• Dec 17, 2020 - dog got loose, captured video at my front door • Summer of 2021 - their dog attacked couple walking by my house. Couple called the county - this is documented with the county
• Nov 30, 2021 - dog loose video at my door and on my driveway • Jan 17, 2022 - dog loose on my driveway and front door video • Jan 20, 2022 - dog loose on my driveway video
• Jan 21, 2022 - dog loose by front door video
• Jan 29, 2022 - dog loose driveway video
• Feb 16, 2022 - dog loose, front door and driveway video • Feb 17, 2022 - dog loose driveway video
• May 23, 2022 - both dogs loose on driveway video
• May 31, 2022 - 19:32 hrs, dog loose again and attacked young Asian couple with their small dog. 2 audio recordings of attack. One included small dog yelping as neighbor dog had it in its mouth. • May 31, 2022 - 20:50 hrs, dog loose again, video
• August 2022 - braking dog complaint submitted to county • Aug 21 - Dog loose on Edgecliff and down Kroeger. Video. • Oct 4 – dog got loose two times this day!! Video included • Oct 9 – dog got loose again – video provided
The parking issue is a nuisance. There is no overnight street parking in Fullerton, yet they park 2-3 cars on the street nightly. This clearly shows they don’t care and don’t think rules apply to them. Also note that while they park their vehicles on the street overnight, there driveway is often empty. They just don’t think rules apply to them. Parking enforcement has been notified and they have come out to issue citations on multiple occasions. However, the neighbor boasted to our other neighbor how she didn’t have to pay the fines they received because she went to the city to complain and they cancelled the citations. Why would the city of Fullerton encourage this behavior? Another time they got tickets the neighbor said it wasn’t a big deal, they would just keep the tickets on their vehicles so the following nights they wouldn’t get any additional tickets. Again, they think rules don’t apply to them. They would rather spend the effort to circumvent the system rather than correct the issue and abide by the rules.
Another example of their inability to correct an issue is their pool equipment. While I understand pool equipment can and will fail, the issue is that when it does, they fail to correct the issue and it continues to persist. Furthermore, they also fail to fix the issue timely. Three times since end of May this year their pool equipment stop operating correctly and omits a very loud whining noise heard inside my house with all windows closed. So bad that Ive had to sleep in a guest bedroom on the other side of my house. Dates below.
• May 24, 2022 - pool equipment broken, making a very loud whining noise. Can hear inside my house with all windows and doors closed.
• July 13, 2022 - woken up at 02:45 from their pool equipment.
Broken and running so loud sounds like it’s in my bedroom. Had to sleep in extra bedroom on other side of my house. 2nd time this has happened with pool equipment. Also, while up, their dog was outside barking on and off for 2+hrs.
• Sep 6 - pool equipment broken again and very very loud. Audio recorded and saved. Finally repaired Sep 16. It took 10-days to repair!!! Again, I understand things break but my concern is that everything is repetitive. It’s never really fixed and each time it breaks, I have to suffer the loud noise it emits. I can’t sit outside and enjoy my backyard and can’t sleep in my bed.
They have continuously left trash around their home, driveway and at the street, giving the appearance we live in an unkept area that is not clean nor maintained. Trash cans were kept on the driveway with trash bags overflowing for the last year until someone called code enforcement. The issue is the trash overflowing from the trash cans and the trash bags laying on the driveway next to the cans. They have kept large trash items at the curb, on the street for weeks at a time. This clearly gives a very negative and unsanitary appearance for our street and our neighborhood. They have regularly left full kitchen trash bags on their side balcony. I have asked them to stop this practice as it attracts rodents. The trash bags have continue to be kept outside. In fact, on that side of the house you can still trash outside on their side of the fence line. They simply don’t care. In August, I placed a rat trap by their trash bags that are kept outside, but on my side of the fence. Within 24hrs the trap caught a rat. I shouldn’t have to live like this and they don’t care as they never corrected the issue.
Listed below are some additional items I want to share as you decide whether or not to approve a STR permit for residents who don’t follow rules and disrupt the entire street and neighborhood.
• March 15, 2022 - video of sons white BMW speeding in front of house, very loud
• June 3, 2022 - 10pm at night, video/audio of sons white BMW with loud muffler, gunning engine waking up neighbors. Sounds like a bomb going off.
• June 4, 2022 - large party in backyard. Their dog was locked up on side porch area, incessant non stop barking for 4hrs.
• June 11, 2022 - party. Guests started arriving at 19:30 and ended around 00:30. Very loud music played outside via DJ or stereo equipment. Guests were very loud. Music stopped approx 23:45. • July 26, 2022 - 5pm kids outside blasting music. I can hear music in my house with all windows and doors closed. Party with street filled with cars parked up and down Edgecliff, some double- parked.
• July 31, 2022 - open trash bags outside on side balcony attracting rodents. Text to keep trash in trash cans. Photo taken • Aug 7 thru 9 - Dog was constantly barking, day and night. Monday night 2am, she was barking and some neighbors and I woken up. • Aug 10 - Party set up. Music playing outside until 10:06pm. PA system used. Dog secured in side of house trying to escape for hours making noises.
• Aug 11 - large party. Cars down to Kroeger. DJ and PA system.
Called Fullerton PD at 2203hrs. FPD said I was second call they received. FPD arrived at 2237hrs. No more music but still loud with people yelling in backyard.
• Aug 12 - Mercedes stopped in front of my house and gunned engine. Video. INTIMIDATION. When this neighbor is upset with you, they begin the intimidation tactics.
• Aug 18 - caught rat in rat trap 10’ from where they leave trash on the side of their house. Photo
• Aug 20, Sat - 04:53am dog started barking and continued for approx 20-min. video clip
• Sep 3 - found AirBNB add posted to rent 3 rooms. Photo saved. This explains all the visitors seen over last 3 -4 weekends. • Sep 16 - Sat night, Airbnb cholos in backyard smoking marijuana, cars coming and going dropping more kids off. Loud music and swimming until 2245. Kids on the street until 145am.
• Oct 4 – dog got loose two times this day!! Video included • Oct 9 – dog got loose again – video provided
• Oct 23 – left multiple large mattresses and other large items in the street 4-days prior to their scheduled pickup.
• Nov 9 (approx) – homeowners continue to park their vehicles on the street overnight and Parking enforcement cited them yet again.
In closing, I recognize I have shared a lot of information. My intent is to paint a very clear picture of what I have been living through over the past 20 months, with the hope that you will not support contributing to this chaos by granting them a permit to further destroy my street and neighborhood. I truly believe if you’ve taken the time to read through everything I’ve shared, you would clearly see a pattern that they don’t follow rules, don’t correct issues and conduct themselves in a manner than nothing is their responsibility. Given that, I can’t imagine how anyone would want to give them a permit to use their home as an Airbnb rental hotel.
I request that any and all I have shared/provided be kept confidential and not disclosed to the neighbors at 1850 Edgecliff Dr, or anyone other than City of Fullerton employees involved with this process, for fear of retaliation.
Respectfully,
Andrew Todd Liverman
Fullerton, CA 92831
From: Larry Bennett
To: Short Term Rentals
Subject: [EXTERNAL MAIL]: STR-2022-0036- 1850 Edgecliff Date: Monday, November 14, 2022 4:26:02 PM
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Dear staff and Commissoners,
>
> I write in opposition to the short term rental permit application for 1850 Edgecliff. (STR-2022-0036) >
> My name is Larry Bennett and I reside at My property is 3 lots away from the subject property.
>
> The prior property owners were quiet and respectful of the neighbors. This is not the case with the current owners. They seem to treat the home as a giant party venue with frequent events lasting well into the night. While I try to be tolerant of my neighbors and don’t feel like filing police reports, I can’t imagine how much worst the situation would become if this property were turned into a short term rental. Even I’d it is only a partial home rental. >
> The size of the property would invite large groups to rent it for the express purpose of having parties. This would be very incompatible with this well established single family home neighborhood. >
> I therefore respectfully request that the permit be denied. That will maintain the peace of the neighborhood and eliminate what I’m sure would be numerous calls for police to shut the parties down. >
> If you decide to grant a permit I hope you will limit the number of occupants to a small size (6-8) and require they observe a quiet period between 10:00pm and 8:00am.
>
> Thank you in advance for your consideration.
>
> Larry Bennett
>
> Sent from my iPhone
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From:
To: Short Term Rentals
Subject: [EXTERNAL MAIL]1850 Edgecliff permit-STR-2022-00036 Date: Tuesday, November 15, 2022 8:44:15 AM
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I am writing this email in response to 1850 Edgecliff AirBnB Permit, STR-2022-0036. I am a neighbor a few houses away from the property for over 33 years. I am also the former owner, founding broker of Century 21 Discovery, across from St Judes Hospital. I will try to sum up the situation from a neighbor and professional view point.
Our neighborhood has been historically a calm and tranquil one. This all changed a few year ago when the new neighbors moved in. They do not abide by the laws in Fullerton and take no responsibility for their actions.
The main problem is that they rent out their home to those who have large parties that carry on late into the night. The neighbors have tried to talk to them, but their concerns are ignored. The permit is so they can rent the home and turn the property into business. This property sits on the top of Raymond Hills and has a great view.
This would make a bad situation even worse.
Where it it sits right now. The conversation in the neighborhood is no longer about our kids and grand kids or what we may have done that day. Rather, it is about the latest episode at 1850 Edgecliff. We are fearful of involving the police for two reasons. 1. We fear retaliation from the owners and/or who ever they allow to use the home. 2. A police record of a nuisance neighbor would be required to be disclosed if the neighboring properties were sold. Many of the neighbors are talking about selling to get away from this problem and do not want their property values lowered. My hope is that the permit will be denied.
I can be reached via cell phone if you need further information.
Respectfully, John Shipley
From: William Scopis
To: Short Term Rentals
Subject: [EXTERNAL MAIL]STR-2022-0036
Date: Wednesday, November 16, 2022 7:10:46 AM
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I was informed that 1850 Edgecliff Dr. Fullerton 92831 is seeking a short term rental permit. The current owners purchased the property in December 2020. After their family moved in, our quiet neighborhood has an influx of cars parked on the street, cars blocking the street, late night activity, noise and their large dog has wandered the neighborhood several times.
I am highly concerned that our quiet neighborhood which is mostly occupied by retired people that have lived in this neighborhood for well over 30 years will be disturbed. Additionally, I believe that our property values will be adversely affected by an active short term rental property on a large property with many rooms.
I hope this review board strongly weights the concern of the neighborhood and our experiences with so far with owners to deny the permit request.
Thank you,
Bill Scopis
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From: Gmail
To: Short Term Rentals
Subject: [EXTERNAL MAIL]Fwd: STR-2022-0036 OBJECTION LETTER 1 of 7 Date: Tuesday, November 15, 2022 6:00:56 AM
Attachments: 11132022 .docx
Audio of broken pool equip and their dog barking -Aug 20.MP4 Airbnb ad prior to permit approval (whole home).png
Airbnb ad prior to permit approval .PNG
Please find attached my letter of objection to the permit application for a STR at 1850 Edgecliff Dr.
In addition to the attached letter, I am including 25 files (audio, video & photo) to support my objection to the permit application.
This will require multiple emails to be sent. There will be 7 SEVEN total emails… Please feel free to contact me.
Respectfully,
Andrew Todd Liverman
Fullerton, CA 92831
Sent from my iPad