CITY COUNCIL MINUTES
MINUTES FOR Meeting of February 7, 2023
As Approved by the City Council at their regular meeting of February 21, 2023
The City Council Regular meeting was held via teleconference pursuant to AB 361. Pursuant to AB 361 (2021), Teleconference Restrictions of the Brown Act Have Been Suspended, as Well as the Requirement to Provide a Physical Location for Members of the Public to Participate in the Meeting. The City of Sebastopol City Council meeting will not be physically open to the public and all City Councilmembers will be teleconferencing into the meeting via Zoom.
COUNCIL PROTOCOLS FOR MEETING:
• This meeting is being conducted utilizing virtual settings for teleconferencing and electronic means consistent with State of California Executive Orders regarding the COVID 19 pandemic and AB 361. • Live stream and zoom are being utilized for this meeting. • Members of the public may view and listen to the meeting by use of Zoom and Live Stream as noted on the City’s website and as noted on the agenda.
• Members of the public wishing to speak to the City Council may do so during public comment or may comment on agenda items during the discussion of each item and must be logged into Zoom. Live Stream is a viewing only format. • Anyone using abusive, vulgar, offensive, threatening, or harassing language, personal attacks of any kind or offensive terms that target specific individuals or groups will be muted, will be asked to adhere to protocols and /or will be removed from the meeting.
Reminder please leave your microphones on mute until called upon and if you would like to provide your name during public comment you are welcome to do that but do not have to.
Please note that minutes are not meant to be verbatim minutes and are meant to be the City’s record of Actions Taken (Approved Motion of Agenda Item(s)).
4:00 PM Special City Council Meeting Start Time for Design Review Board and Climate Action Committee Interviews
CALL TO ORDER: Mayor Hinton called the Special meeting to order at 4:00 pm.
ROLL CALL:
Present: Mayor Neysa Hinton – By video teleconference
Vice Mayor Diana Gardner Rich – By video teleconference Councilmember Sandra Maurer – By video teleconference
Councilmember Jill McLewis – By video teleconference
Councilmember Stephen Zollman – By video teleconference
Absent: None
Staff: City Manager/City Attorney Larry McLaughlin
Assistant City Manager/City Clerk Mary Gourley
INTERVIEW(S) for Vacancy(ies);
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
1. Interview(s) for Vacancies on the Design Review Board (Responsible Department: Planning/City Administration)
Current Term Ending Dates: December 31, 2022
Ted Luthin Category B (corrected)
Marshall Balfe Category D
Cary Bush Category A
Interview time Name of Applicant Category Applied For
4:00 pm Marshall Balfe Category D
4:20 pm
4:40 pm
Lynn Deedler
Cary Bush
Category B (corrected)
Category A
• a)Two (2) persons, at least one of whom shall be a licensed architect and at least one of whom shall be a • licensed landscape architect.
• b) One (1) person who may be any of the following: architect, landscape architect, building designer, • building contractor, landscape contractor.
• c) Two (2) persons not in Sections (a) or (b)
• d) One (1) alternate who may be in Section (a)or who possesses a particular expertise in the area of design, land use patterns, urban development or other related fields to serve at any meeting or on any matter in the absence of a Board member, or in the event a member has a conflict of interest. • (e) ln the event suitable candidates satisfactory to the City Council in the above categories are not available to serve, the City Council may then select any person or persons in their discretion. All terms of office shall terminate December 31 of the last year of the term of appointment.
City Council Action: None Taken. Interviewed Applicants Reference Order Number: 2023-025
2. Interview(s) for Vacancies on the Climate Action Committee (Responsible Department:
Planning/City Administration)
Current Term Ending Dates: December 31, 2022
Josho Somine (Ecological background)
Woody Hastings (Climate Action or other climate group)
Alex Goodman (Climate Action or other climate group)
Gerry Glaser (Climate/sustainability background)
Vacant Youth Position (1 of 2 youth positions)
Time of Interview Name of Applicant
5:00 pm Emmett Hopkins Climate background
5:20 pm Zeno Swijtink Climate Action or other climate group 5:40 pm Josho Sominee Climate Action or other climate group 6:00 pm Alex Goodman Ecological background
City Council Action: None Taken. Interviewed Applicants Reference Order Number: 2023-026
Mayor Hinton adjourned this portion of the meeting to the regular meeting at 6:07 p.m.
6:30 pm Regular Portion of the Agenda Start Time
Call to Order: Mayor Hinton called the Special meeting to order at 6:31 pm.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
Roll Call:
Present: Mayor Neysa Hinton – By video teleconference
Vice Mayor Diana Gardner Rich – By video teleconference Councilmember Sandra Maurer – By video teleconference
Councilmember Jill McLewis – By video teleconference
Councilmember Stephen Zollman – By video teleconference
Absent: None
Staff: City Manager/City Attorney Larry McLaughlin
Assistant City Manager/City Clerk Mary Gourley
Administrative Services Director Ana Kwong
Planning Director Kari Svanstrom
Police Chief Ron Nelson
SALUTE TO THE FLAG: Mayor Hinton led the salute to the flag.
PROCLAMATIONS/PRESENTATIONS: NONE
STATEMENTS OF CONFLICTS OF INTEREST: Conflicts of interest may arise in situations where a public official deliberating towards a decision, has an actual or potential financial interest in the matter before the Council. In accordance with state law, an actual conflict of interest is one that would be to the private financial benefit of a public official, a relative or a business with which the Councilmember is associated. A potential conflict of interest is one that could be to the private financial benefit of a Councilmember, a relative or a business with which the Councilmember is associated. A Councilmember must publicly announce potential and actual conflicts of interest, and, in the case of actual conflict of interest, must refrain from participating in debate on the issue or from voting on the issue and must remove themselves from the dais.
There were no stated conflicts of interest stated for this meeting by Mayor, Vice Mayor or Councilmembers.
Mayor Hinton recommended a change to the agenda and requested Item Number 15 be moved after item number 11. The Council was in consensus to move Item 15 forward in the agenda.
CONSENT CALENDAR: The consent agenda consists of items that are routine in nature and do not require additional discussion by the City Council or have been reviewed by the City Council previously. These items may be approved by one motion without discussion unless a member of the City Council requests that the item be taken off the consent calendar.
The Mayor will read the consent calendar items; ask if a Councilmember wishes to remove one or more items from the consent calendar; and then open public comment to the members of the public in attendance. At this time, a member of the public may speak for up to three minutes on the entire consent calendar and request at that time that an agenda item or items be removed for discussion.
If an item or items are removed from the consent calendar, the item shall be placed at the end of the regular agenda items unless otherwise determined by the Mayor or Mayor Pro Tern.
Councilmembers may comment on Consent Calendar items or ask for minor clarifications without the need for pulling the item for separate consideration. Items requiring deliberation should be pulled for separate consideration and shall be placed at the end of the regular agenda items unless otherwise determined by the Mayor or Mayor Pro Tem.
Mayor Hinton read the consent calendar.
Mayor Hinton asked if any Councilmember wanted to remove a consent calendar item. There were no requests.
Mayor Hinton opened for public comment on consent calendar items only.
Mark Sanchietti commented as follows:
Mark Sanchietti commented as follows:
• I just want to express my gratitude
• Thank you for all the work that we are very excited about the future of little league. • Our numbers are up and continue to grow.
• We are excited as a league and a community for continued numbers and growing and some security in our fields for the youth for the current and future generations to come.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
Mayor Hinton called for a motion.
MOTION:
Vice Mayor Rich moved and Councilmember Zollman seconded the motion to approve Consent Calendar Items 3, 4, 5, 6 and 7.
Mayor Hinton called for a roll call vote. City staff conducted a roll call vote.
VOTE:
Ayes: Councilmembers Maurer, McLewis, Zollman, Vice Mayor Rich and Mayor Hinton Noes: None
Absent: None
Abstain: None
3. Approval of Minutes of January 17, 2023 City Council Regular Meeting Minutes (Responsible Department: City Administration)
City Council Action: Approved Minutes of January 17, 2023 City Council Regular Meeting Minutes Minute Order Number: 2023-027
4. Resolution Authorizing Continued Use of Teleconference Meetings Based on Circumstances of the COVID-19 state of emergency and that the following circumstances exist:
The state of emergency as a result of COVID-19 continues to directly impact the ability of the members of City Council and the members of the City’s subordinate Committee’s, Commission’s, and Boards to meet safely in person; and
The State of California and the City of Sebastopol continue to impose or recommend measures to promote social distancing.
Resolution needs to be submitted to Council every 30 days Continuation of Virtual Meetings:
First Approved: September 21, 2021
Approved for Continuation:
October 19, 2021
November 16, 2021
December 7, 2021
January 4, 2022
February 1, 2022
March 1, 2022
March 15th 2022
April 5, 2022
May 3, 2022
May 17, 2022
June 7, 2022
July 5, 2022
August 2, 2022
August 31,2022
October 18, 2022
November 15, 2022
January 3, 2023
January 17, 2023
Proposed Action: February 7, 2023 City Council Meeting Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
City Council Action: Approved Resolution Authorizing Continued Use of Teleconference Meetings Based on Circumstances of the COVID-19 state of emergency and that the following circumstances exist:
The state of emergency as a result of COVID-19 continues to directly impact the ability of the members of City Council and the members of the City’s subordinate Committee’s, Commission’s, and Boards to meet safely in person; and
The State of California and the City of Sebastopol continue to impose or recommend measures to promote social distancing.
Resolution needs to be submitted to Council every 30 days Continuation of Virtual Meetings:
First Approved: September 21, 2021
Approved for Continuation:
October 19, 2021
November 16, 2021
December 7, 2021
January 4, 2022
February 1, 2022
March 1, 2022
March 15th 2022
April 5, 2022
May 3, 2022
May 17, 2022
June 7, 2022
July 5, 2022
August 2, 2022
August 31,2022
October 18, 2022
November 15, 2022
January 3, 2023
January 17, 2023
Proposed Action: February 7, 2023 City Council Meeting
Minute Order Number: 2023-028
Resolution Number: 6507-2023
5. Approval and Adoption of Resolution Approving Amendments to Sebastopol Little League for Use of City Ballfields and Finding this Action Exempt from the California Environmental Quality Act (CEQA) Under Section 15301, Class 1 (Responsible Department: Planning) City Council Action: Approved Resolution Approving Amendments to Sebastopol Little League for Use of City Ballfields and Finding this Action Exempt from the California Environmental Quality Act (CEQA) Under Section 15301, Class 1
Minute Order Number: 2023-029
Resolution Number: 6508-2027
6. Adoption of Resolution authorizing the closure of Main Street during the 2023 Apple Blossom Parade, Saturday, April 29, 2029, the use of the South High Street Parking Lot for the Apple Blossom Festival and suspending section 201 of ordinance no. 696 during the 2023 Apple Blossom Festival, Saturday, April 29 and Sunday, April 30, 2023 and Finding this Action Exempt from the California Environmental Quality Act (CEQA) Under Section 15304(e). (Responsible Department: Police)
City Council Action: Approved of Resolution authorizing the closure of Main Street during the 2023 Apple Blossom Parade, Saturday, April 29, 2029, the use of the South High Street Parking Lot for the Apple Blossom Festival and suspending section 201 of ordinance no. 696 during the 2023 Apple Blossom Festival, Saturday, April Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
29 and Sunday, April 30, 2023 and Finding this Action Exempt from the California Environmental Quality Act (CEQA) Under Section 15304(e).
Minute Order Number: 2023-030
Resolution Number: 6509-2023
7. Approval of Sebastopol Rotary Club Sponsorship Request (Sebastopol Rotary Club Application Music Event Concert at Ives Park June 3, 2023) (Responsible Department: Administrative Services Director/Public Works)
City Council Action: Approved Sebastopol Rotary Club Sponsorship Request (Sebastopol Rotary Club Application Music Event Concert at Ives Park June 3, 2023)
Minute Order Number: 2023-031
INFORMATIONAL ITEMS/PRESENTATIONS: NONE
REGULAR CALENDAR AGENDA ITEMS (DISCUSSION AND/OR ACTION):
8. Consideration of Appointment to Vacancies on the Design Review Board (Responsible Department: Planning/City Administration); New term ending Date: December 31, 2024 City staff presented the agenda item recommending the City Council consider appointment to the Vacancies on the Design Review Board for new term ending dates of December 31, 2024.
Mayor Hinton opened for questions. There were none at this time.
Council general comments:
Vice Mayor Rich commented as follows:
• I was pleased to see that we have 3 applicants and all of them are really committed to our community interest.
• I was particularly impressed with Cary Bush, who has established commitment to the Design Review Board and is interested in continuing the level of expertise and the experience that he offers to the Design Review Board.
• Not to mention the general positive and collaborative cooperative community attitude are very compelling to me.
• I was also impressed by Marshall who has been an alternate for this last term and brought I thought a really interesting perspective as an architect with a community minded perspective. • He is interested in taking on the more permanent position no longer being and moving into a regular term.
• This would be 2 of the 3 I would prioritize for their established commitment and willingness to continue • For the 3rd person that interviewed with us, an individual I have great respect for and have known in the community for a long time.
• I am not convinced he is the right choice for the Design Review Board at this point. • The given history and given his particular perspective and very strong opinions on design related topics. • I could go into it more if need be, but I would pass on that despite my very deep appreciation given our lengthy and involved conversations about issues that are particularly important to me. • Despite the for purposes of the community needs I would pass on his application for the Design Review Board
Councilmember Maurer commented as follows:
• I have a question and that is that Marshall offered to be a regular and not just the alternate.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• Cary Bush said that he wanted somebody else to apply for his position and that he is only applying because nobody else was.
• Those were his first initial statements that had me concerned. • Is it possible that he could take that position
Director Svanstrom commented as follows:
• The category A, which is currently what Cary Bush holds, is for a licensed architect • Anyone can be an alternate but the category A is a little different though.
Councilmember Maurer commented as follows:
• My other concern is he said he thought that the Design Review Board was not even necessarily necessary. • That he thought maybe you could get rid of that.
• I was very concerned with that statement as well.
Director Svanstrom commented as follows:
• Just to give context because I know the subcommittee came up a couple of times. • The committee is 2 members of the Design Review Board. The members of that are reapplying this evening.
• The Vice Chair of the Planning Commission is also an architect and as you recall from your first meetings in January it used to have Patrick Slayter on that as the representative, but you all asked and I confirmed with the group because of the technical nature of the body that they were okay with him no longer on the committee
• That body is working on design standards and those will be more objective, however those may or may not apply to all developments in town.
• There certainly is something we could transition to over time, however at this time we do not have adopted design guidelines.
• We do absolutely need a Design Review Board to be the review body of that, so it is a transition that could happen over time, but not something that could be done immediately without throwing a bunch of stuff into disarray just because of the way everything is set up. • There would still need to be somebody to review that. • I will say there is certainly a role as a landscape architect and he is a critical component of that because he is one of the members who is a lot more understanding of the landscape elements and the tree elements because that functions as the tree board as well as having landscape architect • I do think there is at this time definitely a need for a Design Review Board. • I just want to clarify was he saying that we didn't need the subcommittee of the planning or the Design Review Board or that we didn't need a design and review board? Because that is what I thought. I believe he was saying when we have those objective standards maybe there is a time we would not need a Design Review Board.
• There are some cities that have a transition from the more discretionary design. Some have moved away from discretionary or they just do not have Design Review Boards, but you would have to have a really robust understanding of what your design requirements were.
Councilmember McLewis commented as follows:
• I just want to say I actually found Cary very refreshing with his comments that he had. • I totally understand the desire to ask other people to step up and to express when you're volunteering in the community when you do it as a serial volunteer sometimes you do have to express that it would be Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
really nice of other people stepped up, but I will stated that doesn't happen. • I appreciate that contribution being a serial volunteer myself I know how that goes. • Honestly I think it is good for us to have honest feedback and I took from him saying if we were able to develop this objective or whatever that I understood that meant maybe we wouldn't need the design review, but it is simply if we reach that point some other places have. • Anyway, I really appreciated his forthright comments
Director Svanstrom commented as follows:
• Category A seat that he holds right now does require that at least one so there are 2 people in the category. At least one is a licensed architect.
• The license architect and that and one should be a licensed landscape architect so they could not switch between alternate and category A.
• I believe Marshall is an architect. However we do need one of those to be a licensed landscape architect.
Mayor Hinton commented as follows:
• Discussed category D and asked if they could step into the other opening • It is a little confusing to me because item B is highlighted yet the application is for category C. • Where is the hole
• Would Marshall be filling category C or B if he were to step into a permanent position instead of the alternate.
Director Svanstrom commented it would be category B. We have 2 C's already and A's.
Mayor Hinton opened for public comment.
Linda Berg commented as follows:
• As I said before, we need to have people concerned with our environment than what is going on these days that of course includes the electromagnetic fields • That needs to be taken into consideration in the planning and design of the town with buildings and sidewalks and meters and everything else.
• We need to have some people with that kind of knowledge or people who would at least listen to it and educate themselves about the consequences.
City Council Discussion and/or Deliberations:
The Council was in consensus to vote on the seats individually.
Mayor Hinton commented as follows:
• I was very impressed with Cary Bush. I think he is an amazing representative for us on design review. • He has a long history, and I love his kind of energy and optimistic attitude. • I think that sometimes when people are interviewing say things that maybe we all need to hear, and that is okay.
• i appreciated his forthrightness in his interview about thoughts on the commission. • Marshall also applied for the alternate, however he is open to filling the full role. • I think he just applied for the same position he held prior. • I am in favor of him filling the other permanent seat. • Unfortunately tonight I am not able to support the third application even in the alternate position. • I have been on the Council for 6 years.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• I have a very strong familiarity with previous interviews and previous situations that involved her planning and design review boards.
• Unfortunately I think that we all can have our strong opinions, but at the end of the day we have to work as a team.
• It is sometimes difficult when people are stepping out beyond and not participating in their role as a part of the team.
MOTION:
Vice Mayor Rich moved and Mayor Hinton seconded the motion appoint to the Vacancy for Category A on the Design Review Board for new term ending date of December 31, 2024 as follows:
Cary Bush Category A
Mayor Hinton called for a roll call vote. City staff conducted a roll call vote.
VOTE:
Ayes: Councilmembers McLewis, Zollman, Vice Mayor Rich and Mayor Hinton Noes: None
Absent: None
Abstain: Councilmember Maurer
The Council discussed the second appointment and process.
MOTION:
Councilmember Maurer moved and Councilmember Zollman seconded the motion appoint to the Vacancy for Category B (corrected from report) on the Design Review Board for new term ending date of December 31, 2024 as follows:
Lynn Deedler Category B (as corrected from staff report) Mayor Hinton called for a roll call vote. City staff conducted a roll call vote.
VOTE:
Ayes: Councilmembers Maurer, McLewis and Zollman
Noes: Vice Mayor Rich and Mayor Hinton
Absent: None
Abstain: None
MOTION:
Vice Mayor Rich moved and Councilmember Maurer seconded the motion appoint to the Vacancy on the Design Review Board Category D for new term ending dates of December 31, 2024 as follows:
Marshal Balfe Category D Alternate
Mayor Hinton called for a roll call vote. City staff conducted a roll call vote.
VOTE:
Ayes: Councilmembers Maurer, McLewis, Zollman, Vice Mayor Rich and Mayor Hinton Noes: None
Absent: None
Abstain: None
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
City Council Action: Approved appointment to the Vacancies on the Design Review Board for new term ending dates of December 31, 2024 as follows:
Name of Appointee Category Appointed to
Marshall Balfe Category D
Lynn Deedler Category B (as corrected from the agenda item) Cary Bush Category A
Minute Order Number: 2023-031; 2023-032; 2023-033
9. Consideration of Appointment to Vacancies on the Climate Action Committee (Responsible Department: Planning/City Administration) New Term Ending Dates: December 31, 2024 City staff presented the agenda item recommending the City Council consider appointment to the Vacancies on the Climate Action Committee for new term ending dates of December 31, 2024.
Mayor Hinton opened for questions. There were none at this time.
Mayor Hinton opened for public comment.
Oliver commented as follows:
• I did write in the public comment about this.
• I did not catch the 2nd half of the discussions with the applicants. • Is one of those people is from actually the City of Sebastopol. • I was quite confused about what the climate committee actually does from the people that were actually talking.
• Just a little surprised of all of these people with the confusion about the City of Sebastopol is incorporated in all the areas
• There are 2 very different jurisdictions from City and County • As you see on my screen, our income is not doing very well at all this year. • I appreciate all the effort but I’m just saying it seems to be burning up a lot of Councill time and staff time, so thank you.
Steve Pierce commented as follows:
• I will have to respond to those remarks to say they don't see much value in it • I would like to point out the grant writer position was just made by the City • That was really from the efforts of the Climate Action Committee. Pushed almost entirely by us and that is one small thing that has been accomplished.
• You may not think it is the role of people who live outside the city to be involved in climate action within the city, but they are critical
• We have 7000 people that live in the city. 40,000 live outside the city boundaries. • They are major contributors to our greenhouse gas emissions and as Alex pointed out earlier they are driving through town. We have quite a bit of reduction of greenhouse gases happening in our town to meet the goals that we already agreed to meet.
• I could go on and on of how the Climate Action Committee can help the City. • I think it has proven they have already helped the City, and do not think it matters if people live outside the city limits because we need all the help that we can get. Thank you.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
Kyle commented as follows:
• I apologize for breaking protocol, but my comment is about the timer itself. • The current format is creating a livestream in which the entire full screen is just the timer • If we can figure out how to get it back to more standard with an actual timer instead of a person having a screen share that is authorizing the entire livestream that would be probably a pretty useful for people with members of the public attending or watching this after-the-fact.
Linda commented as follows:
• Discussed part of our environment is electric medic frequencies that we are living with • To make a discussion on this committee clearer I would like to know or sometime get informed about what the Climate Action Committee is engaged with
• What are they investigating, and what are their actions? Is there public information on that? City Council Discussion and/or Deliberations:
Councilmember Zollman commented he would appreciate casting votes individually.
Mayor Hinton commented as follows:
• I am just going to share my thoughts on the applicants. • I was very impressed with Cary Bush.
• I think he is an amazing representative for us on design review. • He has a long history, and I love is kind of energy and optimistic attitude. • I think that sometimes when people are interviewing confidential they say things that maybe we all need to hear, and that is okay.
• I appreciated his forthrightness in his interview about thoughts on the commission. • Also with Marshall he applied for the alternate, however he is open to filling the full role. • I think he just applied for am in favor of him filling the other permanent seat. • Unfortunately tonight I am not able to support the application even in the alternate position. • I have been on the Council for 6 years.
• I have a very strong familiarity with previous interviews and previous situations that involved her planning and design review boards.
• Unfortunately I think that we all can have our strong opinions, but at the end of the day we have to work as a team.
• It is sometimes difficult when people are stepping out beyond and not participating in their role as a part of the team.
• That is kind of where I am leaning tonight is to leave the alternate position open.
Councilmember Maurer commented she would appreciate casting votes individually and not as a group.
MOTION:
Vice Mayor Rich moved and Mayor Hinton seconded the motion appoint to the Vacancy on the Design Review Board for new term ending dates of December 31, 2024 as follows:
Cary Bush Category A
Mayor Hinton called for a roll call vote. City staff conducted a roll call vote.
VOTE:
Ayes: Councilmembers McLewis, Zollman, Vice Mayor Rich and Mayor Hinton Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
Noes: None
Absent: None
Abstain: Councilmember Maurer
City Council Action: Approved appointment to the Vacancy on the Design Review Board for new term ending dates of December 31, 2024 as follows:
Cary Bush Category A
Minute Order Number:
MOTION:
Councilmember Maurer moved and Councilmember Zollman seconded the motion appoint to the Vacancy on the Design Review Board for new term ending dates of December 31, 2024 as follows:
Lynn Deedler Category B
Mayor Hinton called for a roll call vote. City staff conducted a roll call vote.
VOTE:
Ayes: Councilmembers Maurer, McLewis and Zollman
Noes: Vice Mayor Rich and Mayor Hinton
Absent: None
Abstain: None
City Council Action: Approved appointment to the Vacancy on the Design Review Board for new term ending dates of December 31, 2024 as follows:
Lynn Deedler Category B
Minute Order Number:
MOTION:
Vice Mayor Rich moved and Councilmember Maurer seconded the motion appoint to the Vacancy on the Design Review Board for new term ending dates of December 31, 2024 as follows:
Marshal Balfe Category D Alternate
Mayor Hinton called for a roll call vote. City staff conducted a roll call vote.
VOTE:
Ayes: Councilmembers Maurer, McLewis, Zollman, Vice Mayor Rich and Mayor Hinton Noes: None
Absent: None
Abstain: None
City Council Action: Approved appointment to the Vacancy on the Design Review Board for new term ending dates of December 31, 2024 as follows:
Marshal Balfe Category D Alternate
Minute Order Number:
10. Consideration of Appointment to Vacancies on the Climate Action Committee (Responsible Department: Planning/City Administration) New Term Ending Dates: December 31, 2024 City staff presented the agenda item recommending the City Council consider appointment to the Vacancies on the Climate Action Committee for new term ending dates of December 31, 2024.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
Mayor Hinton opened for questions. There were none at this time.
Mayor Hinton opened for public comment.
Oliver commented as follows:
• I did write in the public comment about this.
• I did not catch the 2nd half of the discussions with the applicants • Is any of the applicants from within the City of Sebastopol • I was quite confused about what the climate committee actually does from the people that were actually talking.
• Just a little surprised of all of these people with the confusion about the city as these are 2 very different jurisdictions
• As you can see on my screen that our income is not doing very well at all this year. • Obviously I appreciate all the effort and I am not knocking that but I'm just saying it seems to be burning up a lot of Council time and staff time
Steve commented as follows:
• I will have to respond to those remarks to say they don't see much value in it. • I would like to point out the grant writer position was just made by the city. • That was really from the efforts of the Climate Action Committee . • Pushed almost entirely by us and that is one small thing that has been accomplished. • You may not think it is the role of people who live outside the city to be involved in climate action within the city, but they are critical for.
• We have 7000 people that live in the city. 40,000 I live outside the city boundaries. • There are major contributors to our greenhouse gas emissions and as Alex pointed out earlier they are driving through town.
• We have quite a bit of reduction of greenhouse gases happening in our town to meet the goals that we already agreed to meet.
• I could go on and on of how the Climate Action Committee can help the city. • I think it has proven they have already helped the city, and I do not think it matters if people live outside the city limits because we need all the help that we can get.
Kyle commented as follows:
• I apologize for breaking protocol, but my comment is about the timer itself. • The current format is creating a livestream in which the entire full screen is just the timer. • If we can figure out how to get it back to more standard with an actual time a person instead of having a screen share that is authorizing the entire livestream that would be probably a pretty useful for people with members of the public attending you.
Linda commented as follows:
• Discussed the environment as electric medic frequencies that we are living with, and there are many kinds of them in many sources of them.
• To make a discussion on this committee clearer I would like to know or sometime get informed about what the Climate Action Committee is engaged with?
• What are they investigating, and what are their actions? • Is their public information on that?
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
Dorothy commented as follows:
• I had one question actually. Is the environmental justice role one of the youth position or an adult position?
• That was my question but just what role or if it was a youth positions are given a clear the way was expressed.
Martha commented is the Climate Action Committee open to the public to attend meetings? Kate commented as follows:
• I have a few questions.
• My first is how much staff time does the Climate Action Committee take each year? • My other question is how much Council time does the Climate Action Committee take each year? • My 3rd is how many members of the Climate Action Committee are residents or and businesses in the City of Sebastopol?
• To this effect if we are using taxpayer resources and Council time and city staff time, and the representatives are not actually residence or business owners in Sebastopol that the Climate Action Committee, well it is doing extremely important work, should be untethered from the city because at this moment in our history of Sebastopol we are very short-staffed, and any staff time is actually budgeted as well.
• I am just wondering what is our exact obligation to the Climate Action Committee in terms of its relationship to the city.
• I am assuming obviously it was founded at a much different moment. • If there is time to maybe take a view on this to see if it can run as an independent committee separate from the city.
Mayor Hinton responded to public comment as follows:
• If you attended earlier you would have heard that we asked practically in every interview about opinions about how people felt about that.
• I think the majority felt, and I do not want to paraphrase, but I am going to, for climate action, if you live right outside city limits but drive through our town every day you are involved in the climate. • That there are many people coming from all walks of life, and some are coming from outside our city limits. Town proper. But still consider it their hometown. • That was explored at length and discussed during those interviews. • I do believe those meetings are open to the public.
• I know Vice Mayor Rich sits on that meeting and obviously the Planning Director is involved. • Maybe we did have a speaker that did not like the three-minute timer we are using. • I think that this might be the first Council meeting I have attended in the three-minute timer wasn't working.
• Technical issues don't happen so I apologize that is happening tonight. • We are one of the Council meetings that shows a gallery view and not all Council in Sonoma County do that.
• We apologize you can see the full gallery in the three-minute timer is up tonight. • As far as youth positions. It was a part of the staff report tonight that we have open positions and they are recommending that if we keep those open we keep them open until reviewed or until filled • We had a speaker ask how much time or how many members or how much effort climate action takes the City Council, and I do not have the specific answer to that question.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• However, I do think that having been on the City Council and the committee was created I think it is an important committee for the community and as far as I am concerned climate action is real. • I think that people are doing good work and we know we have a lot of support for the committee.
Director Svanstrom commented as follows:
• This committee is minimally staff, so I would say it is probably 2 hours a week of staff time. • I will say that the Climate Action Committee and some of the working groups are providing assistance to staff.
• For instance, the requirement for a certain amount of compost. The committee organizes and puts together and does those giveaways that is probably most of the compost procured as this, and they have also been advising us on things like EV chargers and fast chargers that Public Works is putting in with the grant at the parking lot and a couple of other things like the library, which is recently approved by Council • They do take staff time they also contribute back here they are helping us revitalize and reorganize the committee during this.
Vice Mayor Rich commented as follows:
• The Climate Action Committee in my experience having been appointed to it for 2 years now does its own work.
• It is very independent and the group has very deep individual expertise that they bring to their working groups .
• They are not staffed by the way. A lot of the function of the Climate Action Committee the benefit that they bring to the city through their efforts that happens in the working groups, which have the additional benefits of engaging beyond the Climate Action Committee itself.
City Council Discussion and/or Deliberations:
Councilmember Zollman commented as follows:
• I was very impressed with all of the candidates.
• Not only with their level of expertise, but the passion for this type of work and understanding the fact that overall it is not just us alone .
• It is a regional and state and across the country.
• We all need to work together so that type of general focus I definitely appreciate. • At some point I would move to accept all of them.
• In reference to the specific question I would be in favor of posting and keeping them open until full.
Councilmember McLewis commented as follows:
• Listening to the full discussion about whether people should be in the city or not I think we can all agree at least I think most people would agree that we all understand the climate change is happening and the important work the committee is doing.
• A large brain trust is always a good thing that there it is whatever we are discussing that is always important.
• I truly appreciate the benefits they brought talking about the composting in different things. • Listening to the comments and processing this it’s as though we are kind of missing some of the comments
• When lines are drawn whether it is a county or a city or a state there is a reason that happens and that is because taxes and voting.
• We do not necessarily want to have policies influenced by people who do not actually live in our community.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
Vice Mayor Rich commented as follows:
• I respect the comments made, which also reflect comments we have from members of the public, but respectfully disagree a community that benefits from a much larger population, which we have heard from.
• We also have that larger population that we serve.
• The policies do affect them, and they affect us, so we are not talking about the group of individuals that are on the Climate Action Committee that live in a different county or faraway. • These are people who are just outside of our borders. • We do have an urban growth boundary that we respect completely. • We do have a very small city boundary.
• On the comments made by Councilmember, I echo his comments in terms of the applicants. • I would support all of them.
• I would support keeping the open positions posted in continuing to recruit without a specific deadline.
MOTION:
Councilmember Zollman moved and Councilmember Maurer seconded the motion to appoint to the Vacancies on the Climate Action Committee for new term ending dates of December 31, 2024 as follows:
Appointee/Name of Applicant Category
Emmett Hopkins Climate background
Zeno Swijtink Climate Action or other climate group
Josho Sominee Climate Action or other climate group
Alex Goodman Ecological background
And
Directed staff to reopen the two youth positions, environmental justices’ position and business representative positions based on input from CAC members, that the position be posted as ‘open until filled’.
Mayor Hinton called for a roll call vote. City staff conducted a roll call vote.
VOTE:
Ayes: Councilmembers Maurer, McLewis, Zollman, Vice Mayor Rich and Mayor Hinton Noes: None
Absent: None
Abstain: None
City Council Action: Approved Appointment to Vacancies on the Climate Action Committee as follows:
Appointee/Name of Applicant Category
Emmett Hopkins Climate background
Zeno Swijtink Climate Action or other climate group
Josho Sominee Climate Action or other climate group
Alex Goodman Ecological background
And
Directed staff to reopen the two youth positions, environmental justices’ position and business representative based on input from CAC members, that the position be posted as ‘open until filled’.
Minute Order Number: 2023-032
PUBLIC HEARING(s): NONE
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
REGULAR CALENDAR AGENDA ITEMS (DISCUSSION AND/OR ACTION) CONTINUED:
11. Public Art Committee Update to Council and approval of Site for New Art Commission and Finding this Action Exempt from the California Environmental Quality Act (CEQA) Under Section 15303(e) and 15311 Class 11 (Responsible Department: Planning)
Planning Director Kari Svanstrom presented the agenda item recommending the City Council Receive the report, provide any feedback to the PAC and approve the PAC’s recommendation to pursue the selected location for new art sculpture and issue a new call for artists.
Marghe Mills-Thysen made a presentation.
Mayor Hinton opened for questions.
Councilmember Maurer commented as follows:
• Discussed the locations
• Discussed Ives Park work plan
• Hope this would not interfere or be in conflict with that work plan Director Svanstrom commented as follows:
• Displayed a map of the area. That would be on the lower side of the trail. • You can actually see the city land. This is where the trail ends. • It would be North of the trail, which right now it is constrained, but within the channel. • It would still be North of the trail.
Vice Mayor Rich commented as follows:
• Discussed ss you are coming into town there is a bench now at the entrance to the trail in • Are there any visual barriers to seeing whatever art might be placed in that location? • I just cannot recall whether there is anything in front of the driver as they approach that. • Is it completely open?
• Asked if this is private property
• I will just trust the public arts committee here that the visual line of sight isn't blocked by that long wood fence.
Director Svanstrom commented as follows:
• The only thing that is there is the parking.
• Showed the street view.
• There is parking, but other than that there that is something we will talk with regional park as to whether or not they would like to formalize that or if they are fine with it going away or how it gets integrated into an art piece at that location.
Mayor Hinton opened for public comment. PAC’s recommendation to pursue the selected location for new art sculpture and issue a new call for artists.
Kyle commented as follows:
• What efforts are being made to increase the diversity on the Public Arts Committee • What efforts are actively being used engaging unrepresented artists groups in addition to the youths that are taking place
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• To the Council, with any upcoming vacancies for these committees, please commit to having increased inclusivity in actively engaging artists and members of unrepresented groups a priority in your decisions to appointments to this committee
Oliver commented as follows:
• I grew up in an impoverished bohemian family. My father was an artist. • My sisters, editor of an arts magazine that I have been living with the arts all my life. • I am wondering if you could rent out the sculptures that you put up to local artists and actually get some revenue in for the city.
• There is an awful lot of local artists that would like to showcase their work.
Shane Paul commented as follows:
• Nice presentation
• Education of Arts
• Comment is as driving north on Petaluma Avenue triangle looking at • Would putting art in this area distract drivers looking at art and drivers miss people in the crosswalk Linda commented as follows:
• Warms heart of vote on Lynn Deedler
• Three flexing muscles
• Discussed art in Berkeley
• More share of talent in this area
• Rich in many ways
• See eight foot tick by Laguna holding cell phone giving real time information of water meter usage • Amplify what is going on in this town
• Efforts to get Laguna signage on Lyme disease
• Discussed benches in Healdsburg
• Colorful benches throughout town
• Need to get someone to go through with gauge meters
• Discussed magnetic fields and PGE
Kate commented as follows:
• My only comment is the public arts funding comes from a special impact fee on development, so it is a cost to developers.
• My question is about the best use of money for our community given the fact that at our last Council meeting we were talking about giving up the independence of our fire department because we are unable to fund it .
• We often have discussions in City Council meetings about how our staff is overworked and functioning in multiple capacities, so once again I am wondering how much staff time to the public arts committee take?
• How much public works time do these projects take?
• And if at this particular moment in time they bring our community value in proportion to other needs that the community has , for instance once I get in the special impact fee is added to the cost for developers, so it seems the money should be either used for the direct benefit of necessary services since we do not Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
seem to have enough money to cover the necessary services or to bring revenue into our community to raise sales tax.
• I do not see how a static public art collection of 2 pieces and a community sculpture garden can generate the type of revenue and visitor attraction that would garner the use of these funds. • If the funding was going to reoccurring arts events that brought in many visitors throughout the years like Friday events or a 2nd line parade or festivals or something like that where you are bringing in many people it wants to our city is seems like it would have an economic benefit. • Once again, I completely support it. It is just that I have been listening to the meetings for the past 2 years and there is a consistent theme of lack of revenue and a very overtaxed staff , so I am just wondering if this is once again the committee was developed over 10 years ago. • Possibly in a different context and condition for city. • I am just wondering if you might want to revisit this. Especially since the funding for this seems to be dwindling down.
• What happens to the community sculpture garden if we no longer have the bandwidth to keep that? Michael McGinnis commented as follows:
• Obviously I have been involved in this and how much I appreciate that city values art in general and that it is a public thing.
• The amount of money that was set aside or is set aside is minuscule compared to what it cost to do major things like the fire department.
• Obviously not one employee's salary for a year I would imagine. • It is really important because it sort of creates a move to the community. • I have had a lot of speakers come to the junior-college when I worked there talk about public art and how it changes the communities position and the outlying surrounding public view of the community. • Of course it is a tiny town, but an artist down to the last thing I would say is I think the spot you have chosen is excellent because it is one that will be seen as a gateway going into the trail and off into nature. • And then of course coming into the city. It is sort of a marker for that trail being there. • I heard someone mention it might be a distraction, but it could be a way of recognizing people coming across the trail too.
City Council Discussion and/or Deliberations:
Councilmember Maurer commented as follows:
• I really appreciate the presentation so much.
• I didn't know that the sculptures would be rotated.
• I like the idea of having sculptures in different parts of the city. • I have an idea of myself that I will send to the planning commission. I appreciate you asking. • I do art and I make small sculptures. I am thinking how can I make a large one? That would be really fun. • I found your presentation inspiring.
• There may not be a direct revenue generated from public art, but there is an indirect revenue generated because Sebastopol feel attractive coming here.
• They come here and that attracts revenue indirectly.
Marghe Mills-Thysen commented as follows:
• I would refer people to the ordinance that sets up the public's art committee. • The funds are dedicated for public art, and it is not just there happens to be funds and we are taking them.
• It created that fund for the public art.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• I would just like to say it is great to want to include more different ethnic groups in the arts committee. • I hope that anybody else will encourage people to apply. • The same way that if people are concerned about funding that they themselves will go out and create a fundraising opportunity.
• They could even themselves benefit by volunteering and helping out of the staff and the city to do something creative and put yourself where your heart is and do it for you rather than dismantle other positive things that are going on.
Councilmember Zollman commented as follows:
• Thank you very much for the presentation.
• I have seen the wonderful impacts of art and how it can open many doors, as we have discussed and heard from the community.
• I would move to approve the site for the new art commission.
Councilmember Maurer commented as follows:
• I wanted to make one more comment and I am wondering if they considered saving up the funds for something really splendid
• The second idea was I really like the idea that one of the commenters made about gorgeous benches, and I just wanted to second that, so thank you.
Mayor Hinton commented as follows:
• I can't address that but we do save the funds and that is how we have gotten the bigger art projects like the one we are approving tonight.
• The funds are typically saved up to I think about the $30-40 thousand dollar range for the bigger pieces.
Councilmember McLewis commented as follows:
• I just wanted to comment about different people commenting we could draw more people here. • I just hope that somehow you might connect with some tourism to let them know we have this and also they have a new app that offers features when you are actually going out throughout Sonoma County. • You can build an itinerary.
• That is something they lost in the last few months.
• I have been encouraging businesses and anyone who has anything that could draw visitors to Sebastopol to perhaps check to see if you could add it to that, so I think addressing people talking about we need to have more people coming into the town I think that Is a perfect opportunity to do that, so thank you.
MOTION:
Councilmember Zollman moved and Vice Mayor Rich seconded the motion to Receive the and approve the PAC’s recommendation to pursue the selected location for new art sculpture as stated in the agenda item report and issue a new call for artists.
Mayor Hinton called for a roll call vote. City staff conducted a roll call vote.
VOTE:
Ayes: Councilmembers Maurer, McLewis, Zollman, Vice Mayor Rich and Mayor Hinton Noes: None
Absent: None
Abstain: None
City Council Action: Approved receipt of the report and approved the PAC’s recommendation to pursue the Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
selected location for new art sculpture and issue a new call for artists.
Minute Order Number: 2023-033
12. Discussion and Consideration of Amendment to City Council Meeting Protocols (Public Comment For Items Not On the Agenda Item Only). This item is to provide direction to staff on Public Comment for Items Not On the Agenda Location on the Agenda and direct staff to include the preferred option when City staff returns with amendments to the City Council Protocols at a future City Council meeting. (Requestor: Councilmember Maurer/Agenda Review Committee/Responsible Department: City Administration)
Councilmember Maurer provided the agenda item with the following additional comments:
• This is my first formal agenda item request, and it means a lot to me. • At the very beginning of our new Council, the Mayor had moved the public comments on non-agenda items to the back of the meeting. The end of the meeting. • We received a lot of comments on this issue.
• People asked to not have it at the end.
• The Mayor said that she would have 10 minutes at the beginning and then 10 minutes at the end. • I continue to get the comments on this, and the majority of people asked for these comments to be placed at the beginning.
• No one asked for them to be at the end.
• When I was at the conference in Sacramento asked several other City Councilmembers there about the placement of timing of public comments on non-agenda items. • Palo Alto, Fairfield, and one other city.
• They all allowed 3 minutes with no cumulative time limit at the beginning of their meetings. • All of Sonoma County cities allow 3 minutes. 4 have not looking at the time limits. The rest allow 30 minutes. Except Petaluma, which allows 20 all at the beginning of their meeting. • They both allow continuation of public comments at the end of their meetings. • The Sonoma County Supervisors have public comments at the end, but also start the meetings early in the morning.
• In my campaign I stated I value the people's viewpoints and believe in inclusivity of public opinion essential to solving community challenges.
• The way I see it is I think about the organizational chart for Sebastopol. • You have the residence on top. They are the boss but the residence. • Underneath that is the Council. Underneath that is the City Manager and staff. • We are elected to serve the residents.
• I believe we are really lucky to have a really engaged residence here and Sebastopol. • They are our eyes and ears and by law we are required to provide a reasonable amount of time for comments on non-agenda items.
• This is a part of our business. This is what we are here to do. Not something extraneous. • The policy set the goal for completing public comments on non-agenda items in about 20 minutes. • I think if you pulled all the cities in California it is likely the majority have no cumulative time limits.
Mayor Hinton commented as follows:
• I'm going to weigh in as co-author of this agenda item. • This was brought and authored with Sandi with her thoughts and also with my name on the agenda item. • As anybody that was a Councilmember knows we consistently ran over time. • We consistently had agenda items that were on agenda and never got to.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• I was asked by a number of people on the Council and the public to try to figure out how to efficiently come up with a better way to run the meetings, so in particular if items were agenda is that people did not wait all evening have their item her to only be told at 9:00 at night we weren't going to get to the item.
• Members could ask me if they could put times on agenda items so they would know when to tune in. • We know that is not really possible. Someone had to calculate public comment. • And full transparency I do not remember the policy from 2017 that was in place that allowed 20 minutes. • It does not allow as I digested a few minutes ago that we allow 10 minutes of public comment in the beginning and then more public comment at the end.
• The policy has to be tonight and I think it is fair to hear from both the public and Councilmembers about how they feel it has been working this year.
• And what we might be able to come up with for a solution moving forward that satisfied everybody's needs.
• Members that want to comment on items not on the agenda and those is showing up to the meetings for the items that want to be heard on public notice decisions that were making us here with that I will entertain it looks like the Councilmembers and is up.
Mayor Hinton opened for questions.
Councilmember Zollman commented as follows:
• I appreciate the addition of this item on the agenda, so thank you to everyone who brought this forward. • Pre-COVID if you wanted to speak you had to identify yourself first and last name and also the topic, which then helped the chair of the commissions were things out about how and what topic most people were interested in.
• I do not think we could do that here.
• I think giving the Mayor those 20 minutes for discussion of deciding whether it will be 3 minutes or 2 minutes for those 20 minutes makes sense.
• I did not see their was prohibition in the 2017 of doing all the agenda is items and taking the rest of the public comment.
• I did not see that would be prohibited and that would be my recommended approach to this.
Vice Mayor Rich commented as follows:
• I appreciate the comments and bringing the item forward. It allows all of us to address it. • This is kind of a hard one where it is hard to just ask questions without having some discussion, but I have a question.
• This is directed at both Councilmember Maurer and the Mayor. • I am wondering if we look at the possibility of 20 minutes. • My concern with that is that we want to give enough people an opportunity to speak. • As I think about the history of the City Council I can't recall at a meeting in 2 years when there were fewer than 10 members of the city or the public at our meetings. But there is a lot of engagement. • My question would be whether there is an opportunity to set a time limit at the beginning that would allow a maximum number of speakers and maybe discretion is the way to go. • My thought was how about 20 minutes with each at the beginning of the meeting? • Allotted 2 minutes and then any remaining comments are left to the end of the meeting. • Maybe honestly would have to be 10 speakers and 2 minutes each.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• Sometimes there is a delay in between as we transition. 10 speakers with 2 minutes each at the beginning and then at the end of the meeting 3 minutes each for as many members of the public as can be fit in.
• I am just wondering if maybe that is a question for later, but I'm wondering whether that might be acceptable within the parameters of the staff report that we are seeing. • My suggestion would be that we consider maximizing the allocation of that 20 minutes so that we actually have that, so that we can actually commit to 10 people being heard in that 20 minutes. • The other comment that I would make, just to be clear is that I have received comments from members of the public, that we are able to get to agendized items in a timely fashion. • I recognize the needs of the residents but want to remind everyone that on these items, the needs of the residents are important, too.
• They need to have an opportunity to speak on items that have been noticed and I am hopeful that we won't lose track of that, but yes, we do agree that all members of the public need to be heard, at some point .
• I will leave it at that, for the moment did we still obviously need to go to the public themselves.
Councilmember McLewis commented as follows:
• As we know that we have received a lot of e-mails regarding the changing of the time, none other than you and Vice Mayor Rich have had the ability to see the opposite and the e-mails you may have received over the last year, when people went over it, so I bring this up because I was at a different Councilmember and Mayor meeting and they actually pulled everyone to ask where they hold the minutes and there was not anyone in the room that held the public speeding. • Everyone was at the end to look at the different ways we do it in California • Last year, obviously changed the space on your experience and I respect that and I respect that people need to have the opportunity to speak, but I'm trying to gauge. • They likened it to a restaurant reservation. Do you see that people have a reservation or those who show up at the last minute and I don't know if that's right or not, but that is what the league of cities used as an analogy.
• So, what has been your experience?
• I received a lot of e-mails, just like we are now, saying last year that the timing had changed.
Mayor Hinton commented as follows:
• To answer your question specifically, I really didn't receive e-mails that said the time had to go to the end of the meeting.
• It was more like complaints that we were running over and people would get frustrated that they had to leave the meeting after they sat until 9:30 for their agenda item and then we could get to it because, we have a policy that unless all Councilmembers agreed to go forward, after 10:30, we don't move forward on any other noticed items.
• It has been pointed out by speakers on this call, even, that we never got to our committee report. • We frequently went over.
• So, really, when I started out as Mayor, this was just, this was meant to be a trial, to try to keep things on schedule and try to serve the public.
• There are other ways, as I'm told, to supply public comment. We get written letters, I answer the phone, I get phone calls.
• To move my thinking was that I wanted to give priority to the agenda items. • I am not trying to stifle the public in any way, but just as a test and now, here we are, we have tested it, into February.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• We have tested it two months and I am willing to hear from the public on this issue and understand, understandably it's interesting that most of the letters we have gotten are not necessarily from regular people making public comment on items not on the agenda, but more about the policy, I guess, that they feel like their voices aren't as on par.
• That is why I had hoped to maybe do a compromise, as a next phase • Some people it is convenient to make public comment at the beginning, but for other, it's during dinner hour and they are getting home from work and it's not always ideal and that's the only place people can make public comment.
• That's just in response to that question, if that answered it.
Mayor Hinton opened for public comment.
Martha commented as follows:
• I'm one of those people who is falling asleep right now because I was up early to teach and I will be up early tomorrow to teach and I am not able to stay up much later than this. • My vote is very clearly to continue having public comment at the start of meetings and I, if there are people who have to eat dinner at 6:00 or 6:30, continuing comments after the items are through, that is fair, too, so there's a space for people before and after. • I think that this is a core matter for democratic process and I really appreciate the experiment, Mayor Hinton, where you say you don't want to stifle people.
• I appreciate that because that is what it feels like and also, I don't think the analogy to a restaurant is accurate
• It is so hard for the public to have input, to have matters brought to the Council agenda and if I wait until I get into that restaurant, I don't think it will happen. • I'm really tired, but the option of having time at the beginning, like all the other, the common trend within the county, I think that makes good sense and Councilmember McLewis, I am not sure where that location was and what time the meeting was, but I appreciate that we have input about what other specific and named locales are doing and I don't see why we wouldn't follow suit. • My vote, I like very much, Vice Mayor Rich's suggestion, carrying over for a specific estimated time and after 10:30, whenever things are wrapping up.
Loretta commented as follows:
• I want to just share what happens at the high school board meeting and I think that they allocate 20 minutes at the beginning of the meeting.
• It sounds like something similar to the library process and then, you have to fill out a card before the meeting about what your topic is, and then they see at the beginning of the meeting how many people there are and then they can divide it up depending on how many speakers want to talk • I like the idea of having the 20 minutes at the beginning of the meeting, getting all of the items, because I am waiting for one at the end, and then if there's anybody left over and still awake, they could also have a chance to talk at the end of the meeting so you hit both people having dinner and people just getting home and at the end.
• I think having this compromise is a good idea, to let more people speak.
Kate commented as follows:
• I want to echo what others have said did I appreciate Mayor Hinton's thought and care in making sure that these items are actually heard, because as a member of the public without too many meetings, I Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
think it's extremely frustrating and unfair of those items being posted and not actually dealt with in that timeframe.
• I liked the set 20 minute period, with 10 speakers and the rest of the speakers at the end, I think that is a good idea and it also does respect Mayor Hinton's respect for agendized items • I think that that seems like a good compromise and I just wanted to say that if there is a return to in person meetings, that would be useful, probably, for many people to be able to make their comments at the beginning of a meeting rather than having to sit in a hall or something for the entire Council meeting to take place and then for them to make comments.
• I appreciate this investigation of the process, and I think there is a way that we can balance out the ability for people to speak and then still hold a nice schedule so all of the items are actually heard when they are supposed to be.
Kyle commented as follows:
• What's clear from the list is the restricting of public comment to some fixed total amount, for municipalities that are much larger.
• We've had a Council that historically has not enforced this particular aspect but I recognize that at particular times, this policy might be needed.
• The zoom platform itself contains the tools needed, surveying the public in a sufficient manner. • The most recent Councils erratically deviate without this, justify with the continuum with the outcry with the subsection of our residents that are seeking to have, to voice their concerns about that financial decision and they might have been repeatedly coming meeting after meeting, they have chosen to not adequately address citizens concerns, failed to engage these members of the public in a manner that would lead to meaningful discourse, failed to put those concerns forth in a timely manner and have made efforts to silence their voices by this decision to experiment with having no public comment. • In a larger sense, the city has failed to engage the public, with outdated information , even this evening's meeting was buried behind two layers within the past Council meeting, sometime just after 4:00. • Next, the decision by the Mayor, to ban a policy to experiment with no debate, no dialogue • Are there other policies the Mayor could abandon?
• Mayor Hinton provided justification, and this is entirely a false narrative. • What is missing is any evidence, specifically with public comment, with non-agendized items. • I would suggest that anyone wishing to defy this argument to provide receipts. • These meetings are likely to result of Councilmember grandstanding, a failure of preceding Mayors to maintain the timely progressions of the meetings, and instead allowing for repeated, redundant political record, but again, the responsibility is on the Council itself.
Dorothy commented as follows:
• There is a problem of having half at the beginning and is certain of what is left over at the end. • There is something social, important, communicating within the community that the people who do not hear the end or do not hear the beginning will not be able to be informed and connected to the issues in the community.
• So, separating it does that.
• Then I want to wonder, why do we have to have issues discussed with these non-agenda items in the same meeting?
• Why can't we have a monthly meeting of non-agenda comments and everyone who wants to go and hear and become part of the community and know of all the issues can come to that meeting and it could be an hour or an hour and a half or two hours and all the issues brought up.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• Or, then, on the other hand, I am in favor of having it at the beginning, a short, clear statement of two minutes each, I like that idea, and then add to that, I suggest, a monthly meeting of all of those comments.
• Just a thought, because, the issues really are important, because when they are addressed, they stop. • They stop being proliferating and having so many in the meeting, as our last speaker said and addressing the concerns .
• To have an open place for people to express those comments and what about making one meeting a month for just that?
• It's a new idea, I hope.
• I will just say, I am very much in favor of having it at the beginning, and then , and, not waiting until the end.
Oliver commented as follows:
• Very quickly, I mean, the Council has been on since 4:00 this afternoon. • Kudos to you, because this is hard work.
• One suggestion I have is, for example, today, we have the burning issue of the fire station and what will happen there, and in my opinion, it's helpful to put hot ticket items like that at the front of the agenda, where the ad hoc decision was going to be the last agenda item that got reshuffled at the beginning of the meeting.
• That doesn't help anyone because people coming to look at the Website who were not at the beginning do not when the ad hoc committee when will be discussed. • Kudos to you, because you been here a long time, but maybe it would be helpful to just have the agenda be of more explicit about what exactly will be discussed and then you won't have people on the edges of things that aren't on the agenda that they aren't talking about which is happening a lot. • The agenda for the Council meeting would be shuffled around at the beginning of the evening and people would be texting each other and saying, have they discussed this yet, why are they talking about this, you know.
• I think that everyone can save time by being better organized .
Angela commented as follows:
• I would like to read what I've submitted and then I would have a couple points to bring to your attention. • Dear Councilmembers, the robust democratic process is critical to the health of our city. • I urge you to ensure as broad and diverse public involvement in city affairs as possible. • Our City Council should be encouraging the participation of all citizens, but especially elders and working families who have greater time or invisible challenges. • I happen to represent 25% of Sebastopol's population as an elder 65 years and up and a wide range of elders already in bed or shortly to be so, at the latest, also. • I know our hard-working families are often in bed not much later. • I urge you, pray, to ensure that working families and elders are able to fully engage in our cities political activities, by restoring the public comment period to the front of the meetings, like every other city in Sonoma County.
• By establishing 30 minutes of public comment instead of the current 20, so that we will become the eighth city out of nine, who have a minimum of 30 minute comments. • These actions, by you, tonight, ensure that democracy is alive and well in our community. • I would like to make a point that , we are talking about 20 minutes. • In Santa Rosa, they start the meetings at 4:00 and at 5:00, thereabouts, they have their public comment • They start with 12 people, three minute each, 36 minutes. That's the most generous.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• Then, they have, toward the end, any left over people. It's like, 30 minutes is the norm, we are the exception.
• Everybody speaks three minutes, it's always at the Mayor or Council's discretion to change the time and the other item I wanted to mention was, I agree, totally, with Kyle. • This is on you, the Council, to run a good, tight ship. • Half an hour at the front of the meeting and we are out of your hair, and it's like, when you talk about putting items on the agenda and having them have priority, this is maybe one person or a handful of people in this community that will show up to speak on one issue, one night, in the month. • We are talking about everybody being able to participate on a consistent basis at one time and it's just a shame to see the erosion of the Democratic process and the avoidance of the craziness, which is called democracy.
• I urge you to affirm 30 minutes for our town and three minutes each, at the Mayor's discretion and finally, put us at the beginning, by God.
Linda commented as follows:
• I just want to say, that was brilliant and I agree with the rest of the speakers and Kyle, as always, you are always articulate. Thank you for speaking up.
• So, we need to have Councilmembers who don't waste our time on issues that do not benefit this town • I said earlier, there are many of them, tens of thousands of dollars wasted, a waste of time and money on that audit, which ended up, after Larry searched high and low and found a very capable community in Kilgore, and then Diana Rich, I don't know what she's got going on but it seems like she feels the need to punish somebody.
• Day after day, meeting after meeting, I don't know how much that cost and it was a waste of time. • It took up the time of the agenda, the City Council meeting and it just goes on and on and on and that the disaster that it's going on now and the water meters is another thing. • We've already lost $2.2 million.
• I am speaking on issues with this City Council, a couple of members, have wasted our time and money. • The public wants to maintain control of the fire department, so I am saying, and then there's the other issue.
• We need to have a lot of public comment and we don't need people who waste our time. • I suggest you both resign.
City Council Discussion and/or Deliberations:
Councilmember Maurer commented as follows:
• I just wanted to address the point that Dorothy had raised, and the fact is that, providing a reasonable amount of time for public comments on non-agenda items is a law. • I believe that is a Brown Act law and it has to be a reasonable amount of time and what are public is telling us, consistently, what I have heard in all the e-mails, is that waiting into the end of the evening is not reasonable for them, because many of them are elders, or work and it's not working for them. • So, no one, no one asked, and all the e-mails I have received, no one has asked me, for these comments at the end of the meeting.
• I just want to reiterate that in Sonoma County, four cities have no time limits. They allow three minutes with no cumulative timely. Three have a limit of 30 minute. One has a limit of 20. • But, all are at the beginning of the meeting and all allow three minutes. • I just wanted to reiterate that.
Vice Mayor Rich commented as follows:
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• I have one comment off-topic and I will just put it out there because I am tired of hearing it, I am a big fan of Kevin Kilgore's, I was a big advocate of his, I continue to be good friends with him. • I was present at his swearing in and I am tired of these comments • Going to the topic at hand, I feel strongly that we need to give some public comment at the beginning of our meetings.
• I agree with a number of comments from other Councilmembers, that it's important to give an opportunity at the end of the meetings, even though that might be, or might mean that we end up having more lengthy meetings.
• I am committed to public comment, so if it means splitting the time, that is fine by me. • I would be very open to 20 minutes at the beginning of the Council meeting and I would like to specify as 10 people having two minutes each and then in terms of the end of the Council meeting, I don't know how we structure that, but I would hope we would have an opportunity for that to be open ended. • The intent, from my personal respect to is to engage as many community members as possible in response to some of commented on the policies in other cities, I'll tell you, I've spoken to some of those City Councilmembers.
• They do not have the level of engagement that we have in our City Councilmembers. • We are blessed to have so many people from the public come here. • We need to accommodate them, but we have to accommodate our business. • I see that as an appropriate accommodation and I'm really interested in hearing what my fellow City Councilmembers have to say.
Councilmember McLewis commented as follows:
• I believe in public comment, I believe in compromise as well, and I said that in City Council meetings for the last few years I understand not everyone on the count will has had that experience of sitting real hours and hours and hours of talk and then finding out that an agenda item is removed. • That happened to me and I couldn't tell you how many times and it's frustrating. • I absolutely understand why Mayor Hinton has tried this. • In the spirit of compromise, I to think that doing 20 minutes at the beginning and having it with 10 people and having the remainder at the end, in my opinion, after listening to everyone's comments and letters and calls and e-mails we've received, I think that would be a good compromise and it's not saying it has to stay this way all the time, but I think we all have to figure out how to get the maximum amount of people engaged and we have to honor the people on the agenda and the people who want to have that public comment and the best way to do that is for all of us to compromise. • I understand that some people may not hold that same opinion but we do want to have everyone engaged in the way they can and honor everyone in one place is the best way to go, in my opinion. • That's where I'm at. I just believe we have to have a compromise and still, achieve the agenda for the evening.
Councilmember Maurer commented as follows:
• My comment is that the 2017 policy that was already in place and is already created by previous Council is basically the same thing as what you said you would support, which is 20 minutes with a goal of 20 minutes, basically at the Mayor's discretion.
• If you have a lot of people you can reduce it, if you have less, let it be three. • I would make a motion to maintain the 2017 policy as written. I did make a motion to maintain the 2017 policy and I thought that it did include that comments could go to the end if there were more • Perhaps we can make a motion that does not necessarily reference the 2017 policy but captures the discussion that's been happening, here.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• Just the change that I was four or five commenters, then maybe they could have three minutes each, rather than making them all, having it only be two minutes for 10 speakers because some nights you might only have a couple speakers.
• I would say that divide that time up.
Vice Mayor Rich commented as follows:
• I just want to add to this discussion, having been on the Council the last six years. • At the beginning, people raise their hands and lo and behold, more people raise their hands. • It's not that you can get everyone to say, I am going to public speak tonight and then stick with that , because lo and behold, after someone hears a comment, a lot of times they raise their hand to comment. • I would be in support of the two minute time limit up to 20 minutes, as has been proposed tonight and then continuing to open public comment at the end of the meeting for additional three minute increments.
• If you are willing to compromise but I think it's difficult task to raise their hand and then how do you say, no, you didn't raise your hand, you can't speak.
• I think two minutes at the beginning, and have that be a policy, instead of the Mayor having to make that discretion and then extend public comment to everyone else at the end of the meeting.
Councilmember Maurer withdrew the motion.
MOTION:
Mayor Hinton moved and Vice Mayor Rich seconded the motion to approve the agenda location for Public comment for Item Not on the Agenda to be on the Agenda at the beginning of the meeting to a maximum of up to 20 minutes (two minutes for a total of ten speakers) with additional public comment period at the end of the meeting (up to twenty minutes)and directed staff to include the preferred option when City staff returns with amendments to the City Council Protocols at a future City Council meeting.
Discussion:
City staff requested clarification as follows:
• At the beginning, up to a total of 10 speakers but at the end, we have an additional public comment at the end, up to three minutes.
• Would you be adding language that depending on the number of speakers, that three minutes could be reduced to two, set the end of the meeting we have 30 speakers? • I just want to make sure that that was clear that that's part of the motion that that would be dependent upon the Mayor's discretion depending on the number of speakers at the end of the meeting.
Mayor Hinton commented as follows:
• Yes. I believe everyone is in agreement we might want to add a 20 minute at the end of the meeting • I don't recall ever not hearing speakers, but should we put a time on that • I think there needs to be some discussion, but don't we have, don't we have an end time to the meeting any way that of public comments at the end?
• My concern is, what if we get to 10, 10:00, 10:15, and there's an hours worth of public comment? • Maybe our City Manager should weigh in on this one.
City Manager/Attorney McLaughlin commented I think you need a specific policy about public comment at the end of the meeting.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
Mayor Hinton commented as follows:
• I would add to my motion that up to 20 minutes at our second public comment, as well. • Really, what that does is take our current policy created in 2017 and double the time allowed for public comment.
• Our current policy only covers 20 minutes of public comment and then this would literally give 20 minutes at the beginning, and up to 20 at the end for a total of 40.
Councilmember Maurer commented I would like to hear from the public, but nobody wanted the comments at the end, at least, nobody had asked for the comments at the end, so if you are comfortable with that, adding time to it, I think it's always good to give the public more time.
Councilmember McLewis supported up to twenty minutes for the language in case there are not ten speakers for public comment.
AMENDED MOTION:
Mayor Hinton amended her motion and Vice Mayor Rich seconded the amended motion to approve the agenda location for Public comment for Item Not on the Agenda to be on the Agenda at the beginning of the meeting to a maximum of up to a total of 20 minutes (two minutes for a total of ten speakers) with additional public comment period at the end of the meeting (three minutes per speaker that can be reduced to two minutes per speaker with a maximum of 20 minutes total for this second portion of public comment with a total of 40 minutes for all public comments) and directed staff to include the preferred option when City staff returns with amendments to the City Council Protocols at a future City Council meeting.
Mayor Hinton called for a roll call vote. City staff conducted a roll call vote.
VOTE:
Ayes: Councilmembers Maurer, McLewis, Zollman, Vice Mayor Rich and Mayor Hinton Noes: None
Absent: None
Abstain: None
City Council Action: Approved the agenda location for Public comment for Item Not on the Agenda to be on the Agenda at the beginning of the meeting to a maximum of up to a total of 20 minutes (two minutes for a total of ten speakers) with additional public comment period at the end of the meeting (three minutes per speaker that can be reduced to two minutes per speaker with a maximum of 20 minutes total for this second portion of public comment with a total of 40 minutes for all public comments) and directed staff to include the preferred option when City staff returns with amendments to the City Council Protocols at a future City Council meeting.
Minute Order Number: 2023-034
Mayr Hinton called or a break t 9:300 pm and reconvened the meeting at 9:22 pm Item Number 15 moved to this location on the agenda.
15. Consideration of Creation of Ad Hoc Committee / Follow up to Fire Services and Delivery Study Presentation (Requestor: Mayor Hinton/Responsible Department: City Administration/Interim Interim Fire Chief) provided the agenda item recommending the City Council Consider Creation of Ad Hoc Committee / Follow up to Fire Services and Delivery Study Presentation.
Mayor Hinton presented the agenda item.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
Mayor Hinton opened for questions.
Vice Mayor Rich commented as follows:
• I just want to make sure I'm clear on the items, tonight. • What we are looking at, that an ad hoc committee be created by identification of the members, the duties and tasks, from the timeline. Is that basically it? • I think that this Council in the past, has had good success in developing short-term ad hoc committees, that would focus on studying some alternatives and there is questions raised, with staff, with our City Manager, to bring back how we move forward.
• It makes sense, and I proposed it with a motion last meeting to create a two-person ad hoc committee to get us some more specific details in the Council and to try to get some of those answers that that committee could also schedule some public meetings, if that is what they recommend. • Basically, they come back with recommendations of next steps in the full Council would make choices from that point.
• That's the way I see it. That the various formats be investigated with that combination staffing employees and volunteers, with less than that, with just volunteers or volunteers or career employees. • All of those options could be pursued by this ad hoc committee, correct? Mayor Hinton commented that is what I believe, yes as proposed, here.
Vice Mayor Rich commented as follows:
• My follow-up question is there were a lot of concerns, a lot of unknowns. Others those be investigated? • Could we look at tasks that could include, for instance, various options, the 24 seven, the less than 24 seven volunteers, could we look at the facility input costs, the apparatus needs and costs, the volunteer needs and cost, any other comparisons, versus consolidation, versus JTA, versus some other format? Mayor Hinton commented that is my intent that the ad hoc committee would look further in to the questions we had from last time and could do that and come back and present a fuller picture.
City Manager/Attorney McLaughlin commented as follows:
• It is expected that this would be, with that same subject matter, it was rather time can remain, as a process, but basically, Council could create an ad hoc committee tonight and simply say what it expects it to do and come back with a work plan and suggest a duration so that the ad hoc committee could report back before it has completed its work.
• There are a number of approaches it could take to manage this which would create an ad hoc committee. • It is a matter of time. How much work it is could be time-consuming.
Vice Mayor Rich commented as follows:
• If I could follow up, you mentioned timeline.
• This has been going on for years and years to figure this out. • Do you have an estimate for us? If you look at the timeline? • How much time, if we have an ad hoc, what would be a reasonable amount of time to ask that, to give that ad hoc for the information that would be needed to return to the City Council for what you described as a work plan?
• Is this a 90 day process?
City Manager/Attorney McLaughlin commented as follows:
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• When we talked about this with the staff level, we are looking at the 90 day turnaround . • You could direct the committee to engage, to meet with stakeholders for your opinions and come back with a report from that. To explore every option there is. • The previous committee did that and it took the better part of the year. • That was a long process to explore every option.
Mayor Hinton commented given what you just said, what would be reasonable to expect to be included in a report within 90 days?
City Manager/Attorney McLaughlin commented as follows:
• We could do a report in 90 days that would include the naming of stakeholders and doing analysis based on our own knowledge of what we have learned. Stakeholders and reporting back to the Council's report basically.
• The staff members assigned like the budget committee where the Administrative Services Director is the key staff member.
• We would have the Interim Fire Chief as a key staff member here. • He would help author a report back to the Council after meeting with various stakeholders point to thoroughly explore every question, every option would be probably at least a six month project point Vice Mayor Rich commented as follows:
• What I was listing would be the hero exploration that would be expected to take more time. • That completely is to review every single option in detail . • I don't know that it can be completed in 90 days.
City Manager/Attorney McLaughlin commented as follows:
• We have we haven't analyzed that as a staff that I like to hear what the Assistant City Manager thinks and also the Interim Fire Chief.
• But again, the amount of work that the committee is expect it to do will impact how long it takes to do it Vice Mayor Rich commented as follows:
• But I would just like to make sure, somewhere we get the answer to the question, what would it be reasonable to expect back in 90 days from this ad hoc committee if it is created tonight? • So I think that is important for the public.
Councilmember McLewis commented as follows:
• So if just listening to everything here, it sounds like we can be very specific in where we direct the ad hoc committee.
• I was just wondering from the City Manager, is there, I know we're talking all of these timelines and everything.
• I understand the importance of that and the limitations with ad hoc committees. But is any reason that we need to rush this process because it is so important? • I'm wondering, is there like a constraint we have that I am not aware of? Like we have to have something done a decision?
• I want to understand that better. I don't think there is a rush.
City Manager/Attorney McLaughlin commented as follows:
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• I was merely stating that the more you ask the ad hoc committee to do, the longer it will take them to do that work.
• However, we have a Interim Fire Chief who has some limitations on his time because he is retired and he has all the 960 hour limit.
• We also have some limitations on my time as well. So just maybe six months at the outside.
Councilmember McLewis commented as follows:
• So public and everyone can understand all the different facets of this and also, for myself when you make these decisions and how specific we want to be.
• I just wanted to make certain of that.
Councilmember Zollman commented as follows:
• I am just assuming when we create the ad hoc and we are trying to get down the scope, that all of the work that was done, the Mayor, Mayor Neysa Hinton, indicated that she served on the first ad hoc six years ago.
• So all of the work is kept somewhere. All of the documents, all of the staff reports. • All of that can be relatively put together and given to the stakeholders, which of course, would include the police.
• I would assume that could all be done.
• Then we could do fine, maybe has a Council, to help that ad hoc committee define what is urgent. • As for me, I would want to listen to stakeholders and the police chief to decide what truck is going to fall apart.
• What equipment is faulty what is risking a person's life and the ability to respond within the community. • I am assuming we could do that? Is that correct?
City Manager/Attorney McLaughlin stated that is correct.
Councilmember Maurer commented as follows:
• I like to hear next steps and including the idea of the ad hoc committee which I assume he would be a member of.
• I want to hear from his perspective that was in question.
Interim Chief Piccinini commented as follows:
• Good evening, Madame Mayor and members of the Council. Thank you for pulling into this discussion. • I'm a little more ambitious on the timeline.
• I don't disagree with the City Manager's perspective at all. • These things take time. But we have a lot of grunt work. • Discussed the consultant’s reports. It does set for a good baseline for us to move forward. • Whether it is the semantics of an ad hoc committee or stakeholders, I think some things I would offer to you to consider is that we engage in the process.
• I have been through this a number of times and it is the process that is the key to moving these kinds of projects forward.
• It is to define the mission task. I will give you some really quick examples on what the mission is and hope that it may be helps you to identify what you want out of this. • So as an example, the overriding objective could be identifying and evaluate fire and emergency service deliveries system options. All of those. Again, that got brought up last meeting.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• Develop a potential strategy for addressing the short and long-term remodel of the fire station, develop a potential strategy for addressing the fire engine replacement. • Those are just really quick examples of what the mission might look like. I'm not suggesting that those are it. Those were examples. I'm not suggesting that they would be limited to that. • Then we get to the task.
• I'm going to reflect on some of the questions that came up from the Council during the study session. • So what we need to task to do is to conduct a thorough analysis of the annexing agency in terms of their capacity, what would be the real common scale?
• What are the greater efficiencies? What would be proportionate? What is the real task of the annexing agency?
• We could provide a detailed overview of the process and the annexation process. • We can provide an overview of the governance model that go along with each of the different options that we might be interested in.
• We could provide a detailed overview of if we were to pursue our own parcel tasks, what they would look like.
• I can lay that out in some very clear terms for you to consider. Provide a detailed overview of the bond. • I believe Councilmember Stephen Zollman wanted to look in that a little further. • What would be the fire insurance applications?
• So this is the work in there that we would answer your questions. So we could move things forward. • The end state is what is the product you want? What is the deliverable? What are we going to put in there?
• In three months or so, we could provide a detailed staff report with an executive summary. • We could provide a very compact, compare and contrast report that would accompany that with the key findings and the key recommendations.
• We would come back and return it to full Council.
• I say we, meaning we, the workgroup or ad hoc committee. Whatever you chose to refer to it as. We would deliver a staff presentation. Present everything with all of the options. What are the key findings? • Basically if the final task, the deliverable, that would be to do what we needed to do to give Council as much information as possible so that you are fully informed moving forward. In terms of this very critical decision.
• Discussed defining the role of the stakeholders and what their role is. • It is really important because in this process, we need to clarify every bait's need for inclusiveness. • We need to create the process that is very transparent. • We need to build good relationships which is the foundation of trust in this process. • That is what results in the collaborative, objective outcome. • So with that, this really comes down to all of this process. • I am just giving you some thoughts as to what we could direct the ad hoc committee to do with a little more specificity than, you know, as I hear your questions.
Councilmember Maurer commented as follows:
• With that, I clarification between what an ad hoc committee can do and what a stakeholder group can do?
• What is the difference between the two?
• Can at the public, can members of the public say two members of the conflict , be a part of an ad hoc committee? Or that need to be a stakeholders group?
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
City Manager/Attorney McLaughlin commented as follows:
• Because it is an ad hoc committee, you cannot have members of the public a part of that committee. • However, you could have the committee engage with public or any other people including stakeholders that you direct.
Vice Mayor Rich commented as follows:
• Thank you, Interim Chief Jack Piccinini for those comments and overview. That was really useful. • When I think about what your comments are here, do you, within the context that you were describing your goals, I am seeing those crossover a lot.
• Do you think it would fit within what you are thinking needs to happen here? To have an ad hoc committee that included City Councilmembers, staff, which is what we have done in the past. • It has been very effective, to do the heavy lifting.
• I'm just proposing this here, that we require and reach out to key stakeholders • We could, as a City Council, list those stakeholders. Or we could, as a City Council, leave them up to the discretion of the ad hoc but the ad hoc would sit as its membership, doing its work, and it would reach out to the stakeholders. Then do the work itself.
• Collect documents and do what it needed to do, report back to the City Council. • Address, as I look at how you described it. It was the mission tasks and end state. • The mission we could define as the fire and emergency services options, looking at all of them, or something like that. We define it.
• The tasks in your formula really seemed to be the identify, the pieces I was trying to list out. • Is that, I'm trying to take our ad hoc concept and see where it overlaps with the way that you have seen this point I think it is substantial.
• But can you help me to help identify whether I'm in misunderstanding or misinterpreting what you have said?
Interim Chief Piccinini commented as follows:
• So with regard to the tasks, what I see is that if, some of the Council interest is, like in a town hall meeting, that kind of thing, then that would be an example of something that we would put on the task list.
• Now again, who drives that? Who would lead that?
• We would have to kind of discuss those nuances to determine whether this is something that the Council ad hoc committee wants to take on versus maybe you just detail to city staff • It doesn't need the entire committee or maybe a small group of the committee. • There are a lot of flexible areas and how we manage that. • It is critical to the fine with the mission state is. That helps us to identify where the stakeholders? Then we are able to define the stakeholders.
Vice Mayor Rich commented as follows:
• I think we're talking the same language here. Three months. • Do you really think that, I mean, that is like we would have to check in with staff to see about their timeline.
• But three months seems, to get a full report back to the City Council? Interim Chief Piccinini commented as follows:
• I would say that we have done, as mentioned, a lot of work already. • There is a lot of work that has been done.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• It's my humble opinion, it is my professional opinion, however, that the work has been a bit fragmented. • I think if we engage in a different or newer process like the one I just described, I think we have the ability to pull it all together.
• It depends on as the City Manager mentioned, depends on what role people want to play. • Because that would be a part of, because meetings are the difficult part • That is the difficult part of getting everybody to come to meetings because everybody is so busy. • I feel like we have got a lot of information out there we could pull together pretty quickly.
Councilmember McLewis commented as follows:
• I just want to clarify so that I understand the discussion. We have ad hoc, worker, or committee. • All of these different things.
• I know I have had discussions already about this.
• If we have an ad hoc, we can actually direct them to develop a work plan which could include stakeholders and couldn't include stakeholders within the community who actually could give their feedback.
• If we had a working group where we had community stakeholders I really think that we need to have that. • Could that also include people where we would to a town hall? • Are you ever working group, does that preclude us from having a town hall • Is any of this like have to go down one path and then you are not considering other one? • I'm asking because I want to understand all the different options. • Within all of this workgroup, whatever we did, would it be possible for them to actually figure out the cost associated with redoing the fire station?
• That was seemingly one of the pivotal points where the consultant said we would have to take care of that before you could actually start doing what they would do if we were to merge. • Is that something? Or is that they would actually be able to do? • I know there is a whole process and it can get complicated that way. • I just want to understand better what is feasible.
City Manager/Attorney McLaughlin commented as follows:
• I will tackle the legal part of this.
• That is yes, you can do all those things as part of an ad hoc committee. • You can hold a town hall as the Interim Chief alluded to, for example. • You can engage the stakeholders.
• I am sure you can get a pretty good ballpark figure on the cost of repairing the fire station and bringing it up to where it needs to be.
• If you don't have to go through a bid process to do that. • We have engineers and others who estimate that kind of thing all the time. We are preparing a project to be bid.
• I mean, you can do all of those things.
• I will just say, I appreciate the Interim Chief's ambitious timeline. • We are in the midst of budget preparation where we have nonstop meetings. They have already begun. • So just mention that we can do our best.
• It could be a very ambitious review. I don't know, you know, how long it will take. It takes what it takes.
Councilmember McLewis commented as follows:
• In order to have the working groups, you have to have the ad hoc? Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• I want to understand what is required to have these different groups? City Manager/Attorney McLaughlin commented as follows:
• The ad hoc does its business by running the committee. • The two Councilmembers essentially run the ad hoc committee after receiving direction, of the City Council.
• They ad hoc runs the committee.
• If they want to engage with stakeholders or town hall meetings, then they direct staff to set those up. • They are part of that process and then they help conduct the town hall or engage with the stakeholders. • These Councilmembers basically run the ad hoc. The ad hoc does the work with them.
Vice Mayor Rich commented as follows:
• A comment on that question and answer.
• Ultimately, we, as a City Council, are going to have to make a final decision on this topic. • What I have discovered with ad hoc's that I haven't participated on, is that it allows two City Councilmembers to do the heavy lifting, multiple meetings, Interim Chief Piccinini and with what suggestions are and trying to process it.
• So then when it comes to the full City Council, the rest of us, we have at least two City Councilmembers who have been in the driving seat, working out all of the pluses and minuses. • So that's what I see as the ad hoc.
• In terms of the length of time for this ad hoc, it sounds like, I guess us to be a question to our City Manager.
• If you go forward of this, are you thinking of that, would it be possible to do like an outside plan on six months? We can always extended as we have done that in the past? But then require, for instance, an initial first report out to the full City Council at a public meeting at the 90 day mark? • Then have subsequent reports out? Is that a workable way to kind of navigate this? City Manager/Attorney McLaughlin commented as follows:
• Yes. I am not going to say it takes too long.
• But I do think that this is where I started my comments earlier. • We would want to make an interim report back to the Council at the 90 day period, for example. • A progress report and that we would attempt to conclude the business of the ad hoc within six months. • We have reasons for having to do it that way, given the restrictions on staff, time, and various things that the Council is aware of.
• So six months would be the outside.
• I would certainly not hold the Interim Chief back. If he can pull it off, he will be the driving staff member. • So the Council could direct that a report come back within 90 days. • If we don't finish the ad hoc work, and the six months at the outset could be extended Vice Mayor Rich commented as follows:
• I have to come back to the timeline and what is reasonable. • My first question is, when I sat down and made a list of the open items for lack of another term. • It seemed like we still needed to get a final conclusion on. • I will list of about seven items. I want to read those to you. • I want to know, if you could, whether these are items that you feel would be appropriate within a task lists for an ad hoc committee, okay? Because my assessment may be very different.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• So the first one is facility improvement needs and costs. • The second one is apparatus replacement needs and costs. • The next one is career employee needs and costs.
• I have the timeline for each option that is considered. • I just have a catchall, because stuff happens. Other relevant issues or needs and their costs. • In my final point would be the comparison for the various staffing options you look at, the comparison of independent versus consolidated, versus other options that might seem relevant like JPA • Is that on the list? When you look at all of those factors, comparing how they fall out, depending on whether it Is an independent firehouse or a consolidated firehouse, or some other option like JPA? Interim Chief Piccinini stated that list would be a part of the review.
Vice Mayor Rich commented as follows:
• I think the timeline thing has been answered for me.
• But looking at the staffing options for the you look at all of those factors. • My thought is that the staffing options that would need to be considered would be the 24/7 combination. • Two career employees and one volunteer.
• Then there also seems to be all less than 24/7 using all volunteers and all less than 24/7 using a combination of career and volunteer?
Interim Chief Piccinini commented as follows:
• Stated yes. All of what you are saying is correct.
• I think there needs to be some clarification that some of this we need to start working on regardless of the pursuit of the option, the ultimate option.
• The staffing model and all of the issues surrounding the staffing model are , replacing the fire engine, you know, those are issues today.
• One could argue that the external of the bigger picture. • Yes, we will delve into all of those and the specific nuances to figure this out.
Councilmember Maurer commented as follows:
• Just a quick question on this issue already without affecting our ability to serve on the ad hoc committee? • Discussed Brown Acting with Mayor Hinton
Mayor Hinton commented as follows:
• Once this item has passed, I don't think this affects us at all in serving or not serving together. • Questioned if this is correct for serving on a future committee City Manager/Attorney McLaughlin commented that is correct.
Councilmember Maurer commented as follows:
• My question is, you and I were on the fire services issue. • So does that limit our participation on ad hoc?
• Say I could be on an ad hoc with somebody else because you and I already talked about it? Mayor Hinton commented as follows:
• As I understand is that we had it before the Matrix presentation which is at the last Council meeting. • We have not discussed fire issues since that public meeting. Wwe did review that report.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• So I think that ended our Brown act commitment. Now we are free agents again. • Am I correct, City Manager?
City Manager/Attorney McLaughlin stated that is correct.
Mayor Hinton opened for public comment.
Oliver commented as follows:
• In the last meeting we had on the fire service, nobody wanted an ad hoc committee. It was a long evening.
• At the end of it, the Mayor decided to pass a motion to have the ad hoc committee. • The Matrix recommendation was to have a working group. • I was a bit surprised why this is just sort of that previous meeting which is exclusively about the fire service in completely forgotten. And the public opinion. There were hundreds of people on the call. • Well over 100. There are 35 people on the call It is 10:00 at night on a Tuesday. • This is back to the same old well-worn group of the Council. • Talking amongst themselves about ad hoc committees and what they want to do and how they're going to do it and how in 90 days, they will present stuff to the community and so on. • They might talk to subject matter experts and they might be town halls • So I think there was a very loud call for more transparency in the previous meeting which was exclusively about the fire service.
• It is pretty troubling to me that as we say, back to the same old thing of forget the previous meeting. • It is back to the old-fashioned Council
• I would like to hear from the subject matter experts of the stakeholders in public, and then have an ad hoc committee and maybe three months as I said earlier, there is a budget coming up. • I don't see any reason to have Council heavily engaged in this right now. • I see the Interim Fire Chief being heavily engaged while he is still with us. • And the other subject matter experts, I would love to see detailed members, not from the city, but from independent architects and contractors on refurbishing the fire station for that has to happen no matter What point so we are really rushing this, you know?
• Last week, the big busy meeting. It is like it never happened. • Now here we are, talking about ad hoc committees and people being on previous at a committees • Let's take all of that out and have another crack at it. • It is not very impressive point finally, I would really like to see Jill McLewis on the fire committee. I think that is appropriate.
• The Mayor and Vice Mayor have already bid on ad hoc committees for the fires service. • It is time for some fresh thinking and some transparency.
Kate commented as follows:
• I would just like to echo Oliver's comment about transparency. • It is unclear to me why we can't move forward with the Matrix recommendation of a working group that includes stakeholders and is more transparent.
• I can imagine a working group that has people that are part of our neighborhood emergency response . • Part of our police department, part of our business identity. • I just think that we need more transparency in this whole process as we move forward with the so we would know really what is that date
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• I appreciated Vice Mayor Rich's list. I feel there are a few other items that would be important to that list. • Those are doing outreach to business owners and commercial because the Gold Ridge parcel tax is quite heavy and will burden on our local business owners presence, 14,000 square foot business would have a $2400 a year additional parcel tax.
• I am not sure if now is the time you want to be earning local businesses with additional ongoing taxes. • We don't even know if it is necessary at this point.
• Then at the other part of it seems missing is the purse and retirement contributions that would be necessary if we would then be funding Gold Ridge’s retirement. • That can get quite hefty, specially over time.
• And my last question or comment is City Manager Larry McLaughlin said there is a document that contained every option in it point I'm wondering if that document could be made available to the public so we could see what previous options look like and what kind of information was in that , those options for that also might help inform just the general public as we move forward. • What are the scenarios look like in terms of 18, 19, or 20% of the budget to the fire service which is very much status quo for other cities?
• If we're going to move forward with an ad hoc committee, I would like to propose Jill McLewis and Sandra Maurer as our two representatives.
• They are new to the Council and I believe they have a very open minds in regard to this topic Linda commented as follows:
• That was beautiful what you said and you hit the nail on the head. • Going forward like nothing happened. Over 100 people on that last call. None of us wants the consolidation.
• That is why I don't trust the Mayor and Vice Mayor.
• The last speaker also discussed a community forum, I agree with her. • We need to take this town in a new direction.
• Because they are, I'm sorry to say, Mayor and Vice Mayor are flushing it down the toilet.
Angela commented as follows:
• I think transparency in the process is welcome. That is a welcome thing. • I would like to see what forms of going forward could be successfully incorporated, bringing in the stakeholders that were cited.
• I am particularly interested in knowing what Interim Chief Piccinini, what you have experienced because you have done this numerous times.
• What kinds of configurations or groups have you worked with that of been successful? • I am sure you have worked with a number of ad hoc's and I'm grateful for your presence in our community and the expertise you bring. I thank you for that.
Lisa commented as follows:
• I agree with all of her and I agree with Kate emphatically. • I agree that transparency is key here.
• If we are going to have an ad hoc committee voted on tonight, I would absolutely want Jill McLewis and Sandra Maurer on there.
• Those are the two individuals who I believe who are objective and can provide the transparency and the confidence we trust in this community.
• We didn't have a lot of transparency on this last go around with our ad hoc committee. • I think right now, public trust is a big deal. Because right now, you have lost it.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• If you're going to quickly this, you've got to have two people who you can trust and believe in. • We know, the prior one we didn't have that.
• Look forward to hearing from our Interim Fire Chief. I wanted to listen to the public and I wanted to hear from the Interim Chief.
• So again, I believe that if you're going to go through the ad hoc committee now, which I think is a rush, those are the two ladies would like to have on our committee. • I thank you for providing me the opportunity to comment.
Shawn Paul commented as follows:
• I am a citizen of Sebastopol.
• I questioned the legality and ethics of having item 11 on this agenda. • Discussed the Matrix agenda item
• Public was told no that Interim Chief Piccinini would not speak and was informed multiple times it was not on the agenda for that
• Then Mayor, you turn around to add item 11 to this agenda, even though it was not on last week • Last week's agenda specifically stated that it would be conducted at a future City Council meeting • Item 11 goes against that agenda last week
• Mayor, I would ask you to adjust and to remove this item from the agenda until it can be properly placed on the agenda with the necessary time to see if an ad hoc committee or a different path would be the best action the city and Council should take at this time.
Loretta commented as follows:
• I will reiterate what most citizens of said in public, but before the break, we had such a long conversation about listening to the community and how much time people were going to get to talk. • Now, it seems as if you are not listening to the community. • Last week, there were over, time I looked, there were over 120 people on, just to hear about the fire department. Now we are down to 36 people.
• This is the last item on the agenda today. People have to go to work tomorrow and people of things to do. They can't sit here.
• We need to have something where the full time known of Sebastopol can hear from our Interim Fire Chief was the expert on this opinion.
• They are begging you, let us hear from Interim Chief Piccinini and that is have all the options later. • Don't make a decision for us for this is too big of a decision for one Council said about raising the budget for the fire service.
• Our fire service has been under budgeted for years for that is why we are in the hole. • Now we need to prioritize.
• We gave a bunch of money tonight to art, but I would rather have a fire department if my house is on fire. • So we just need to get our priorities straight at me need to be more open to listening to what the community is asking for.
• I want to also say about the $300 per business plus $.15 per square foot. • So our business, it would cost us $2400 a year for the property parcel tax. • Which we would not of been able to vote on so that is taxation without visitation. • What about the Barlow. I wonder what the property tax will be. Are they aware of what this consolidation would be for their property taxes?
• There are lots of things we to rush this.
• So listen to our Interim Fire Chief and listen to community.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• That is all I will say.
Dorothy commented as follows:
• Over and over, we have heard from the 120 people that were here. Many of them asked to speak with Interim Chief Piccinini.
• From the comments he has made tonight, it seems like this is a place where we should be having a town meeting with people like the Interim Chief and perhaps others so that the whole community can hear the different options
• But and to leave the idea of constructing all of this information into a small ad hoc committee. That promotes the opposite of transparency.
• That is something, I think, that we can do without any problem. • We can leave it and make an ad hoc committee later if it seems to be the right thing. • I really do not think it is the right now.
Debbie commented as follows:
• Discussed the outline of the many of the areas for clarification and a lot of the issues. • So each of those issues, she talked about in terms of cost. • I would like to suggest that the underlying so many of these issues is the government structure and the control of finances.
• By calling out governance structure to those items, that might raise, it make it more apparent how the decision-making would go forward.
S.A.C. commented as follows:
• This is certainly an emotional issue for everybody.
• I would like to make a couple of suggestions.
• I work in the public sector and I have public sessions and we deal with making decisions that affect public funds.
• One way to gain buy-in and support and trust from your community is to start with their voices and listening to them first.
• I would suggest that one process could be to hold a large public meeting at a time when people who work or have dinner at 6:00 could attend, such as a Saturday afternoon. • Listen to what people's concerns are, and help them frame what the ad hoc will look at when the ad hoc is formed.
• I believe it is too early for an ad hoc committee at this time. • I think the public must feel that it is heard before this framework or workgroup is established where going down a narrow path and we feel as though we have no chance to have an influence on where the study is being done.
• I just request, respectfully, that we slow down.
• I echo what Oliver suggested.
• Have these public process meetings and listen to what the public has to say. • And then, perhaps, form an ad hoc and select a committee.
Kyle commented as follows:
• One of the previous speakers made a point about finances. • I think that if you are going to create an ad hoc committee that we would be very clear about trying to separate those Councilmembers that currently exist on our budget subcommittee from the individuals that are on that ad hoc committee.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• They may in the process and be able to reach out to them. • By separating those two, it would allow that ad hoc committee to do work in the space that is without influence or pass influence to that budget subcommittee.
City Council Discussion and/or Deliberations:
Mayor Hinton commented as follows:
• I guess I will start with addressing some of the overall themes that were echoed in public comment and point to the agenda item which was, I want to point out that by a vote of 3-2 in favor of bringing this agenda I wind forward, this was proposed in full transparency at the fire meeting with everyone present. • So this wasn't something that was slipped in later and it was voted upon. • I want to point that out to the public.
• That may be missed part which was indicated with the item tonight in the discussion. • So we voted to bring this forward to discuss an ad hoc committee and if one is set forth with some tasks, I was the one that made the motion so I am in favor of including an ad hoc committee. • That ad hoc committee can determine and help, but by working with our Interim Chief as the lead staff member to answer some of the further questions that we have that remain unanswered at this point. • It is really hard for me to continue to move an item that is so important for the city forward like this without having some pros and cons examined and have somebody lay those out for us and do that work. • I suspect, as we talked about before he went to public comment, that it would take 90 days would be reporting back to the Council.
• But it could take up to six months.
• So I am in favor of creating the ad hoc committee and to do some of the heavy thing to gather this information up to bring it back to the public in full transparency and to recommend to the full Council about moving forward with the possibility of surveys or noticing out in the community or public meetings. • Whatever direction we may go on.
• We have done some of this on different topics in the past. • I would lean heavily on our Interim Chief for what he thinks about that. • I feel like we have had a lot of information. But we need to now narrow it down and come up with some solutions but it doesn't mean it is being rushed.
• It just means we need to , the report left more questions for me than answers Councilmember Zollman commented as follows:
• I would second the creation of the ad hoc committee.
• Because actually, I do feel a sense of urgency from what I have heard with the ongoing discussions. • I do feel unclear in what would be defined as an urgent situation about the status of our equipment that would affect our firefighters and actually, the service time to respond to various crisis. • Yes, I do actually feel a sense of urgency.
• With that, I would also nominate our Mayor and the reason why I am not nominating Councilmember Sandra Maurer is because Councilmember Jill McLewis is serving on another ad hoc. • I am nominating Mayor Neysa Hinton as she has indicated she is done six years doing this. • We have had a lot of discussion about protective resources and emotive time, she really knows, she sat through the maze and she could provide testimony first and about who was present at these meetings. • Rather it was the Interim Fire Chief, what he said or didn't say to kind of pass for this for the third thing I will say is as far as the scope, I would encourage us to follow the advice of Vice Mayor Diana Rich's report and to have our stakeholders, including our Interim Fire Chief define first what is urgent. • Some of these things I do not feel are urgent as far as getting the building up to where could be 24/7. • I don't deem that to be urgent.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• The financing tab that have and, speaking of which, I want to correct the record. • Never going to bond, I was stating a parcel tax.
• But I don't find the financing of creating or fixing our building to make a 24/7 as high of a priority or defining that is being urgent compared to the status of our vehicles, as I said before, and the status of our equipment. Those are my comments.
Vice Mayor Rich commented as follows:
• Continue to be in favor of an ad hoc
• I'm hearing loud and clear from everyone is a message that I have heard from this community on any issue.
• That is engagement and transparency.
• I believe that we can add that, that we can structure this ad hoc in a way that ensures that we have more public engagement.
• That is what we are talking about here.
• I would propose that we require that there be stakeholder meetings that at the 90 day, that we have a 90 day report, status report from the ad hoc committee.
• That we are specifically at that 90 day report, which stakeholders have been engaged, which ones are planned to be engaged in the future, so we know exactly where and how the community has had an opportunity to have a voice.
• That we work in a requirement for at least one town hall. Maybe there needs to be more. But I think those are essential for us.
• I think also, no matter who is on this ad hoc, we have our Interim Chief here. • We have our City Manager, our Assistant City Manager. • We have all the City Councilmembers sitting in this meeting. • Everyone of us absolutely knows of the public wants to know what is going on and want to be engaged. • It is essential to the success of this project.
• So whoever is on us, all five of us, are going to have high expectations about the engagement with the public.
• I'm confident that whoever's on that ad hoc committee will be able to do that. • I actually have to respect and shouldn't be on this committee as I am on the budget committee. • The comment from the public. I think that is a very healthy suggestion. • That would mean that neither Stephen Zollman nor I would be on this ad hoc committee. • I would like somebody who has deep knowledge of the history and that would be with me out of the picture, that would be Mayor Neysa Hinton, assuming she is willing. • Assuming to the other person, I don't know. We don't even know which one is actually interested. So I will be interested in hearing that.
• I will say to those who haven't been through this, Councilmember Jill McLewis, Councilmember Maurer to listen to what Interim Chief Piccinini is said here because I lived it and experienced it. • This is a heavy lift if you're going to be working.
• Anybody who is working on this, you are talking multiple meetings that are lengthy, with a lot of research and a lot of understanding of the intricacies of how a firehouse works, with the support of Interim Chief Piccinini.
• But let me tell you, spent a couple of hours in meetings with him. He was quite generous with his time. • There are a lot of details that are very important.
Councilmember McLewis commented as follows:
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• I don't see the firehouse as being the top priority as far as emergency why this is a misunderstanding on my part or misunderstanding of what I said.
• It is just that the consultant actually said that this one of the pivotal things we need in order for us to move forward.
• So in that essence, it is.
• As far as equipment and everything else, I understand that we have a lot of issues with our equipment. • But I don't think that anyone is in threat, any citizen is at threat right now of not having the services. • That is my understanding.
• With all of that being said, I would just like to express that I am very interested in being on this committee.
• Both Councilmember Sandra Maurer and I, I feel that we both have the ability to be objective with this. • We have the support of the community.
• While I realize I am on an ad hoc committee, it is going, I don't anticipate that it is going to be that long. • I just feel I would really like to be of this to ensure that the community is involved in this no matter what. • I know that others are suggested, not everyone the community is supportive of that. • I think with this decision that this'll probably be the largest decision that this Council makes for future Councils and for its citizens.
• This is just a really long, permanent position.
• I just would really like to be part of that.
Councilmember Maurer commented as follows:
• It appears that the majority of this Council is going to approve the ad hoc committee. • Like what happened at the last meeting.
• I am sympathetic for what the public is saying.
• I think the public needs more transparency.
• The public needs and wants to hear from Interim Chief Piccinini. • So I understand at this point, I can see that I am outvoted. • I am not in a real argumentative mood to try to win anyone over. • I don't think it will do any good point I am glad that Jill has stated that she would like to be on that ad hoc committee.
• I will support her for being on that.
• I think it is probably best for her to be on there with the Mayor if the Mayor is willing to serve on that committee.
• I want to think the public for their comments too.
• I completely believe that it is really important to be transparent and hold that town hall once we decide there will be an ad hoc and who will be on it we will define the tasks because I have comments for that. • I will just wait.
• Am I correct? Or do you want to hear my tasks now?
Mayor Hinton commented as follows:
• I think you should go ahead and list your tasks and try to watch the time tonight. • I think that if we develop an ad hoc committee we would take the tasks that are discussed tonight and then that that ad hoc committee will bring back the full scope of work to the full Council.
Councilmember Maurer commented as follows:
• A presentation from Interim Chief Piccinini. I feel like that is the first thing that should come up.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• That would include the understanding of this overall experience, his qualifications, his feedback on the matrix study.
• A review of all the potential options, including keeping the fire department as it is , and any and all in between.
• Anything, the options need to be on the table, examine with cost, et cetera. • I would like the ad hoc committee to succinctly define the exact nature of the problem that we are dealing with.
• I think the public needs that.
• I would like to see a list of all possible options but I've already said that, including all of the cost of each. • I would like a list of all the known facts about issues, about all of the options. • I would like an examination of the costs of the Gold Ridge parcel tax and the impacts on commercial property, including the annual increases but I would like to see an examination of the per cost. • This is new to me and I hadn't heard about that. I would like to know more about that. • To define the immediate needs of the fire department in short and long-term solutions. • Examination of PERS costs
Vice Mayor Rich commented as follows:
• I think everyone agrees that there is a need for in the task list for the ad hoc. • The factors that will help ensure transparency and engagement of the public. • Can we look at filling out what those ideas might be? • Those that we as a group would feel would likely engage the public? • What would we want from this ad hoc to ensure engagement with the public and transparency? • A town hall meeting has been suggested.
Mayor Hinton commented with the notes that we have, that the ad hoc committee could then start the scope of work and report back after meeting with the Interim Chief in our City Manager.
MOTION:
Councilmember Zollman moved and Vice Mayor Rich seconded the motion to approve the creation of an Ad Hoc Committee and appointment of Mayor Hinton and Councilmember McLewis.
Staff Clarified: City staff included on the Committee would be: City Manager/Attorney McLaughlin, Assistant City Manager/City Clerk Gourley and Interim Fire Chief Piccinini Mayor Hinton called for a roll call vote. City staff conducted a roll call vote.
VOTE:
Ayes: Councilmembers Maurer, McLewis, Zollman, Vice Mayor Rich and Mayor Hinton Noes: None
Absent: None
Abstain: None
City Council Action: Approved approve the creation of an Ad Hoc Committee and appointment of Mayor Hinton and Councilmember McLewis.
Minute Order Number: 2023-040
13. Discussion of In Person or Hybrid City Meetings and Direction to Staff for Amendment to Council Protocols. This item is to provide direction to staff for In person or Hybrid (in person and remote) meeting accommodations following the Declaration from the State of California Governor to Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
rescind the statewide emergency declaration on February 28, 2023. (Responsible Department:
City Administration)
City Administration provided the agenda item recommending the City Council provide Direction to Staff for Amendment to Council Protocols. This item is to provide direction to staff for In person or Hybrid (in person and remote) meeting accommodations following the Declaration from the State of California Governor to rescind the statewide emergency declaration on February 28, 2023.
Mayor Hinton opened for questions.
Mayor Hinton commented a follows:
• So prior to that, prior to zoom, we, as Councilmembers, did have the ability to do a meeting from a remote location with specific guidelines about posting it . • For example, if I'm on vacation and doing it from my hotel room, I have to put a sign out on the door and allow the public if they wanted to come in.
• If we go to in person, those rules can still be utilized, correct? Staff commented as follows:
• That is correct
• You can still use the traditional teleconference
• You would need to state where the location is, where it is going to be held, the hotel as an example would put the name of the hotel, your room where it is going to be located. • Then you would need to make sure that it is A.D.A. accessible and that you are providing a means for a member of the public to hear the meeting and also to provide public comment.
Mayor Hinton commented is there so many allowed per year for teleconferencing per Traditional Brown Act.
Staff stated under the traditional brown act teleconferencing there is no limit under the current Brown Act as long as you provide all of that information onto the agenda, there is no limit as to the traditional teleconference which is pre-COVID or there is no limitation to that.
Vice Mayor Rich commented as follows:
• I am looking the options you have listed. I'm on page six of 36. • I see in person only meetings. Then remote meetings. What is that option? • I understood from your presentation that we don't have the option as City Councilmembers of participating remotely with the exception of those very limited emergency and just cause AB2449. • So what is the remark meeting option? Being the notice for the public.
City staff commented as follows:
• That is if you want to provide the public an opportunity. • In person means there is no zoom capability for a member of the public to be at home and provide realtime public comment. • So in person means every member of the public would need to come to the annex to provide public comment.
• But the remote option is for the public not the Council unless following Brown Act teleconferencing Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• Three members of the Council have to be within the jurisdiction, so you have to be at that meeting. Two members can give just cause of emergency for teleconference. No more than two can be outside of the jurisdiction.
• Tonight is whether or not you want the public to be able to participate through zoom or do you want to do in person and basically, what that means is we just livestream the meeting as we did pre-COVID.
Vice Mayor Rich commented as follows:
• What are our options: In Person for Councilmembers. Traditional Brown Act Teleconferencing • The remote option, it looks like we are being asked to decide whether we want to give the public a remote option?
• Also, reading the staff report, whether we want to give staff, city staff, remote option? • Are those the two remote options?
City Staff commented as follows:
• There are some cities that require all department directors at the meeting. • The remote option gives our consultants the opportunity to do their presentation from remote so we don't have to basically pay for them to be sitting for a meeting. • We can have them zoom into the presentation for the Council and then go away. • Or you can leave it up to City Manager to say whether or not a member of our staff has to be in person • So if that department is present for the meeting, the staff people need to be there, because they have to administer the meeting.
• I like to give the public the remote option, and I would like to give city staff remote option.
Councilmember McLewis commented as follows:
• I think understand all of this, but just to clarify.
• I know we have discussed this. So you can do the AB2449 or the in person, right? • That's my understanding, right? Either or?
• We can use either of those to be remote?
• You can utilize the AB2449 which is a just cause or emergency. • We could utilize the AB2449 or the other option that Mayor Neysa Hinton is mentioned that is always been in place?
City staff commented as follows:
• You could teleconference with the traditional Brown act or the AB2449. • But just remember, no more than two Councilmembers can be utilizing one of the other at the same time.
• There are three that have to be in person within the jurisdiction of the city. • It could also be a cost savings for the city if we are not paying consultants Mayor Hinton opened for public comment.
Kyle commented as follows:
• It looks like you guys are doing the right thing and make it available to the public via remote. • We are in the modern era.
• One of the biggest questions I have that is yet to be addressed is like there is a huge financial technological lift.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• It is my hope that the city has seen this coming for some time and has taken the steps necessary to retrofit whatever the appropriate technology that makes the meetings seamless in terms of the public engagement both remote and in person.
• The last thing I would want is like segregation between these two groups of individuals. • I would love to hear some comments and some staff commentary about what has been done so far. • What the plan is for that.
• Secondly, one term and maybe this is high flex.
• As someone who got done being parted a team retrofitting students at home -- high flex classrooms for that might be some terminology that might be used.
Suzanne commented as follows:
• I stepped away from the computer and I missed part of what you said. • If you have for the public, for me, for instance, if it is hybrid, if I am home and I want to make a public comment, would I be able to?
• Or will I only be able to listen from home?
Linda commented as follows:
• Discussed electrosensitive
• In order to respect our civil rights and ADA needs, we need to, of course to allow us to have, a system that enables us to participate by, in my case, a landline phone. • Again, you know, I spent plenty of time down there at the center. • And it is hot, hot, hot. With all of the stuff there, and the actual the electromagnetic field • I am all for it that we need to have it remote for myself and many, many, many other people in order to participate.
Angela commented as follows:
• Yes, transparency, democracy for the highbred, which we are not supposed to say were raised by Linda just now.
• About making the actual virtual place. Is it virtual? • At the youth annex to make sure that there is that it is accessible to people with EMF sensitivities given the high frequency levels of frequency there.
Mayor Hinton responded to public comment as follows:
• Just to address one of the speakers from the community. • It is outlined on fiscal impact page eight, we have known this was coming for a while. • We did help the community center invest in some equipment. • It will cost us a little bit more, but I think everybody believes this is though way of the future. • We have been preparing for that.
• The actual expense, I believe, is three hours times 60.
City staff commented as follows:
• I do want to reiterate that the equipment is not ours. • That is the Sebastopol community center.
• We help them purchase some of it, but this is their equipment. • They will be running the I.T. as far as the in-person portion of the meeting. • They will be running the cameras.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• There will be a large screen up on the wall that if this Council does remote as well, that will show the zoom on the wall.
• So the Councilmembers can see the zoom and the people in our zoom can see the in-person meeting. • We have done two walk-throughs of this so far. It has gone on pretty much without a hitch. • I'm not saying it won't happen the first meeting that something goes wrong, but we have been through two walk-throughs for this is not our equipment for their running it and they have done two walkthroughs with laptops, microphones, everything set up. • They are good to go. The additional cost is for the additional meetings. • So Planning Commission and City Council both within their budgets so that is not a cost to us. • But when we talk about the arts committee, those all fall under that. That is the cost of the I.T. person. • All standing committees need to follow the Brown Act. That is part of the Brown act. • They would have to follow the other the in-person/remote, so they would have to follow the traditional formula or the AB244
Director Svanstrom commented as follows:
• I would say from our committee members and board members and planning commissioners which have been having the same conversations throughout the pandemic, I do know that we may, because some of our committees have a lot of people who are working and traveling with work may also need to utilize the telecommute.
• I think that will maintain quorums and maintain the consistency of those committees. • I think with in terms of the additional cost, if I had to have all of my consultants, to Sebastopol and be in person, it would probably be awash in terms of the cost because I would need to renegotiate all of the contracts for all of the presentations and things like that. • So we do actually get ways to be a consultant in person going to all these meetings. • Will continue to the use the way we have run those committees in the past is staffed with all the facilitation.
City Council Discussion and/or Deliberations:
Vice Mayor Rich commented as follows:
• I just want to make sure I am clear here.
• So that the whatever we decide tonight in terms of what our City Council rules will be, those same rules will apply to all of our other own act type committees, commissions, Climate Action Committee, budget committee, agenda setting committee? The design review board, correct? Staff stated that is correct.
Vice Mayor Rich commented as follows:
• Discussed telecommuting
• Are you saying that in terms of the Climate Action Committee, to the extent that there Is a quorum that is able to be present at a Climate Action Committee meeting in person the others might participate remotely?
Director Svanstrom commented as follows:
• I suspect some of them may, like the regulations that Mayor went over regarding either the traditional Brown act or the AB2449 for just cause emergency requirements. • Those would then also be available to those groups.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
Vice Mayor Rich commented as follows:
• Just to clarify, if we don't approve in person, which I am not leaning to approve, the option of these emergency circumstances, then that is citywide.
• People on those commissions will have to attend in person. As the old days, correct? Staff commented as follows:
• Stated no. Either or is the option.
• You have the availability of both options.
• We don't have to choose between AB2449 and traditional Brown Act MOTION:
Vice Mayor Rich moved and Councilmember McLewis seconded the motion to approve In person and Remote Format for Meetings (City Council in attendance; and City Staff and consultants to either be in person or approved to remote in utilizing zoom (as approved by the City Manager or City Manager’s designee) and directed staff to prepare protocols for return to future City Council meeting.
Mayor Hinton called for a roll call vote. City staff conducted a roll call vote.
VOTE:
Ayes: Councilmembers Maurer, McLewis, Zollman, Vice Mayor Rich and Mayor Hinton Noes: None
Absent: None
Abstain: None
City Council Action: Approved In person and Remote Format for Meetings (City Council in attendance; and City Staff and consultants to either be in person or approved to remote in utilizing zoom (as approved by the City Manager or City Manager’s designee) and directed staff to prepare protocols for return to future City Council meeting.
Minute Order Number: 2023-035
Mayor Hinton departed the meeting at 11:20 pm.
14. Discussion and Consideration of Amendment to City Council and City Staff Committee and Liaison Appointments, and Finding this Action Exempt from the California Environmental Quality Act (CEQA) Under Section 15320, as follows:
a) Amendment to Climate Action Committee Make Up of Members and Consideration of City Council Liaison to Climate Action Committee. This would be to amend the City Council appointee as follows:
• One City Council Appointed Representative from SCTA/RCPA or Zero Waste; and • One Open Position for Appointment of City Council
City Administration provided the agenda item recommending the City Council Consideration of Amendment to City Council and City Staff Committee and Liaison Appointments.
Vice Mayor Rich opened for questions. There were none at this time.
Vice Mayor Rich opened for public comment.
Linda commented as follows:
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• Discussed water meters that are plastic, non-recyclable plastic. • That will need to be replaced because they were out 5 to 7 years • M point is that it does not matter what the competition is if nobody recognizes the element of what the policy is
• You are implementing the policies that are in direct opposition of all of these plastic, Chinese made, nonrecyclable plastic of smart leaders who keep doing it to make matters worse and worse. • So it doesn't matter what the composition of who was on there, as long as you have that inability to take responsibility
• It just doesn't matter who is on it.
• The thing is, we need new leadership.
• We need to recognize what the real issues are.
• Just resign.
Oliver commented as follows:
• Very disappointed with the conversation earlier about the interviews. • The decision that it was okay for people who were in Sonoma County to apply • I'm assuming the City Council representation will have to be somebody from the city though, is that correct?
City Council Discussion and/or Deliberations:
There was none.
MOTION:
Councilmember Zollman moved and Councilmember Maurer seconded the motion to approve Amendment to Climate Action Committee Make Up of Members and Consideration of City Council Liaison to Climate Action Committee. This would be to amend the City Council appointee as follows:
• One City Council Appointed Representative from SCTA/RCPA or Zero Waste; and • One Open Position for Appointment of City Council
Vice Mayor Rich called for a roll call vote. City staff conducted a roll call vote.
VOTE:
Ayes: Councilmembers Maurer, McLewis, Zollman, and Vice Mayor Rich Noes: None
Absent: Mayor Hinton
Abstain: None
City Council Action: Approved Amendment to Climate Action Committee Make Up of Members and Consideration of City Council Liaison to Climate Action Committee. This would be to amend the City Council appointee as follows:
• One City Council Appointed Representative from SCTA/RCPA or Zero Waste; and • One Open Position for Appointment of City Council
Minute Order Number: 2023-036
MOTION:
Councilmember Maurer moved and Councilmember Zollman seconded the motion to approve appoint the following to the amended Committee:
Vice Mayor Rich – At Large
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
Councilmember Maurer – SCTA/RCPA or Zero Waste Representative • One City Council Appointed Representative from SCTA/RCPA or Zero Waste; and • One Open Position for Appointment of City Council
Vice Mayor Rich called for a roll call vote. City staff conducted a roll call vote.
VOTE:
Ayes: Councilmembers Maurer, McLewis, Zollman, and Vice Mayor Rich Noes: None
Absent: Mayor Hinton
Abstain: None
City Council Action: Approved appoint the following to the amended Committee:
Vice Mayor Rich – At Large
Councilmember Maurer – SCTA/RCPA or Zero Waste Representative • One City Council Appointed Representative from SCTA/RCPA or Zero Waste; and • One Open Position for Appointment of City Council
Minute Order Number: 2023-036
b) Receipt of Staff recommendation for City Staff Representative to the Zero Waste Sonoma SB 1383 Technical Group. This would be to amend the assignment from GHD to Planning.
Vice Mayor Rich opened for public comment. There was none.
MOTION:
Vice Mayor Rich moved and Councilmember Maurer seconded the motion to approve staff’s recommendation for City Staff Representative to the Zero Waste Sonoma SB 1383 Technical Group. This would be to amend the assignment from GHD to Planning.
Vice Mayor Rich called for a roll call vote. City staff conducted a roll call vote.
VOTE:
Ayes: Councilmembers Maurer, McLewis, Zollman, and Vice Mayor Rich Noes: None
Absent: Mayor Hinton
Abstain: None
City Council Action: Approved staff’s recommendation for City Staff Representative to the Zero Waste Sonoma SB 1383 Technical Group. This would be to amend the assignment from GHD to Planning.
Minute Order Number: 2023-037
c) Amendment to Committee Appointment for Ad Hoc Committee for Recruitment of City Manager. This item is for Councilmember appointment to the Committee based upon withdrawal of Committee member (Mayor Hinton)
Vice Mayor Rich opened for public comment.
Kyle commented as follows:
• I just want to remind the Council that we are looking at all options, all options Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• I very much like that the language of this particular agenda item made reference to specifically manager and not manager/ city attorney.
• So please, as this committee goes forward, do not put yourself into a very particular option that would lead us down paths that we might not want.
• But present to the public all available options available as you go to this task of hiring a City Manager. • And then separately, a city attorney. Thank you so much.
Linda commented as follows:
• In my opinion, it is kind of a pivotal time in this town that I love. So many people are retiring and we have extraordinary people.
• I'm sorry to say to the members, the Mayor and Vice Mayor do not appreciate the town that we have here
• I think that it would be very nice since Larry has been so good and he is fair and just. • Of course, in my opinion, seems just a natural that if we could find somebody also because we are so fortunate we are different, you know?
• Let Larry find another City Manager.
• Could be that it is somebody local that is a little bit familiar with the character. • I would recommend that Sandra Maurer as a possibility be placed on the committee City Council Discussion and/or Deliberations:
Councilmember Zollman commented as follows:
• I'm going to nominate Vice Mayor Diana Rich with Councilmember Jill McLewis. • The reason why I'm doing this is because that for the longevity that she served on the Council, I think that would help, along with her past.
• Her past experience being an executive director.
• I think that would really help with the recruitment effort for both of these physicians. • So that would be my nomination.
Councilmember Maurer commented as follows:
• I'm going to second that motion because it was already called at the last meeting where this was voted on • Vice Mayor Diana Rich had expressed an interest in the position. • So I second that motion.
MOTION:
Councilmember Zollman moved and Councilmember Maurer seconded the motion to approve Amendment to Committee Appointment for Ad Hoc Committee for Recruitment of City Manager. This item is for Councilmember appointment to the Committee based upon withdrawal of Committee member (Mayor Hinton) and appoint: Vice Mayor Rich to the committee.
Vice Mayor Rich called for a roll call vote. City staff conducted a roll call vote.
VOTE:
Ayes: Councilmembers Maurer, McLewis, Zollman, and Vice Mayor Rich Noes: None
Absent: Mayor Hinton
Abstain: None
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
City Council Action: Approved Amendment to Committee Appointment for Ad Hoc Committee for Recruitment of City Manager. This item is for Councilmember appointment to the Committee based upon withdrawal of Committee member (Mayor Hinton) and appoint: Vice Mayor Rich to the committee.
Minute Order Number: 2023-038
15. Consideration and Direction to Mayor or his/her Designated Representative for Voting for Various Boards and Committee Vacancies at the February 2023 City Selection Committee and Sonoma County Mayors and Councilmembers Association Meeting (Responsible Department: Mayor/City Administration)
Vice Mayor Rich provided the agenda item recommending the City Council provide direction to Mayor or his/her Designated Representative for Voting for Various Boards and Committee Vacancies at the February 2023 City Selection Committee and Sonoma County Mayors and Councilmembers Association Meeting Vice Mayor Rich opened for questions. There were none.
Vice Mayor Rich opened for public comment. There was none.
City Council Discussion and/or Deliberations:
The Council discussed and conducted a straw vote for consensus on the following letters of interest. Consensus is highlighted in yellow below.
Board of Directors
1. ABAG Executive Board: Alternate ( to fill seat vacated by Dennis Pocekay, Petaluma, term expires June 2023.) 1 letter of interest received: Stephen Zollman – Sebastopol
1. Sonoma County Agricultural Preservation and Open Space District Citizens Advisory Committee: 1 seat (to fill seat vacated by former Council Member Osvaldo Jimenez, Healdsburg, term expires February 2024) 2 letters of interest received: Todd Lands – Cloverdale Mark Stapp – Santa Rosa
2. North Bay Division, LOCC, Executive Board: 1 seat (to fill seat vacated by former Council Member John Sawyer, Santa Rosa, term expires two years from appointment) 1 letter of interest received: Jackie Elward, Rohnert Park
3. Child Care Planning Council of Sonoma County: 1 seat (currently held by Council Member Victoria Fleming, Santa Rosa, term expires three years from appointment)
1 letter of interest received: Stephen Zollman – Sebastopol
4. Sonoma Marin Area Rail Transit Commission: 2 seats (currently held by Council Member Melanie Bagby, Cloverdale, term expires February 2023 and Council Member Chris Rogers, Santa Rosa, term expires February 2023.
2 letters of interest received: Melanie Bagby – Cloverdale Chris Rogers – Santa Rosa
City Selection Committee
Local Agency Formation Commission (LAFCO): 2 seats + alternate (to fill seat vacated by former Council Member Pam Stafford, Rohnert Park and Mark Landman, Cotati and the alternate seat vacated by former Council Member Patrick Slayter, Sebastopol term expires 4-years from appointment) 4 letters of interest received: Sandra Lowe – Sonoma
Susan Harvey – Cotati
Jeff Okrepkie – Santa Rosa
Stephen Zollman – Sebastopol
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
1. Sonoma County Oversight Board Committee: alternate (to fill seat vacated by former Councilmember Osvaldo Jimenez, Healdsburg, unspecified term)
2. Remote Access Network (RAN) Board: 1 seat (must be a Mayor) (to fill seat vacated by former Council Member Mark Landman, Cotati)
3. Bay Area Air Quality Management District Board: 1 seat (to fill seat vacated by former Council Member Teresa Barrett, Petaluma, 2-year term)
1 letter of interest received: Brian Barnacle – Petaluma MOTION:
Councilmember Zollman moved and Councilmember Maurer seconded direction to the Mayor or Voting Representative for Voting at the City Selection Committee Meeting and the Mayors and Councilmembers Board of Directors Meeting of February 9, 2023 as discussed and also moved that if late nominations are received, that the City Council direct the Mayor or Designated Voting Representative to:
1. Direct that late nominations be returned to all Cities for review and recommendation to voting designate/alternates; or if that is not approved, to
2. Abstain from Vote
Vice Mayor Rich called for a roll call vote. City staff conducted a roll call vote.
VOTE:
Ayes: Councilmembers Maurer, McLewis, Zollman, and Vice Mayor Rich Noes: None
Absent: Mayor Hinton
Abstain: None
City Council Action: Approved direction to the Mayor or Voting Representative for Voting at the City Selection Committee Meeting and the Mayors and Councilmembers Board of Directors Meeting of February 9, 2023 as discussed and also moved that if late nominations are received, that the City Council direct the Mayor or Designated Voting Representative to:
1. Direct that late nominations be returned to all Cities for review and recommendation to voting designate/alternates; or if that is not approved, to
2. Abstain from Vote
Minute Order Number: 2023-039
Board of Directors
1. ABAG Executive Board: Alternate ( to fill seat vacated by Dennis Pocekay, Petaluma, term expires June 2023.) 1 letter of interest received: Stephen Zollman – Sebastopol
5. Sonoma County Agricultural Preservation and Open Space District Citizens Advisory Committee: 1 seat (to fill seat vacated by former Council Member Osvaldo Jimenez, Healdsburg, term expires February 2024) 2 letters of interest received: Todd Lands – Cloverdale Mark Stapp – Santa Rosa
6. North Bay Division, LOCC, Executive Board: 1 seat (to fill seat vacated by former Council Member John Sawyer, Santa Rosa, term expires two years from appointment) 1 letter of interest received: Jackie Elward, Rohnert Park
7. Child Care Planning Council of Sonoma County: 1 seat (currently held by Council Member Victoria Fleming, Santa Rosa, term expires three years from appointment)
1 letter of interest received: Stephen Zollman – Sebastopol
8. Sonoma Marin Area Rail Transit Commission: 2 seats (currently held by Council Member Melanie Bagby, Cloverdale, term expires February 2023 and Council Member Chris Rogers, Santa Rosa, term expires February 2023.
2 letters of interest received: Melanie Bagby – Cloverdale Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
Chris Rogers – Santa Rosa
City Selection Committee
Local Agency Formation Commission (LAFCO): 2 seats + alternate (to fill seat vacated by former Council Member Pam Stafford, Rohnert Park and Mark Landman, Cotati and the alternate seat vacated by former Council Member Patrick Slayter, Sebastopol term expires 4-years from appointment) 4 letters of interest received: Sandra Lowe – Sonoma
Susan Harvey – Cotati
Jeff Okrepkie – Santa Rosa
Stephen Zollman – Sebastopol
4. Sonoma County Oversight Board Committee: alternate (to fill seat vacated by former Councilmember Osvaldo Jimenez, Healdsburg, unspecified term)
5. Remote Access Network (RAN) Board: 1 seat (must be a Mayor) (to fill seat vacated by former Council Member Mark Landman, Cotati)
6. Bay Area Air Quality Management District Board: 1 seat (to fill seat vacated by former Council Member Teresa Barrett, Petaluma, 2-year term)
1 letter of interest received: Brian Barnacle - Petaluma
PUBLIC COMMENT FOR ITEMS NOT ON THE AGENDA
Speakers are allowed to speak for a maximum of three minutes so that all speakers have an opportunity to address the City Council.
Power point or visual presentations for public comment shall not be permitted unless approved by the Agenda Review Committee two weeks prior to the requested meeting date.
Speakers may not "yield" a portion of their allotted time to others.
The Mayor has the authority to limit or extend the time allowed for speakers dependent on the number of speakers in attendance.
The Mayor can poll the members of the public for an indication of the number of people wishing to speak, then call on individuals to speak.
It is the goal of the Council to conclude the public comments portion of the agenda within 20 minutes. If the public comment period exceeds twenty minutes, the presiding officer, typically the Mayor, reserves the right to reduce the time per speaker or carry over public comments to after all business items are completed.
The City Clerk will monitor the time for public comments and inform the speakers when the time limitation has been reached.
The Mayor could survey the members of the public, as appropriate, to move agenda items up or back to address the members of the public items of concern.
Public participation is encouraged on all public agenda items.
Council and staff will treat participants and each other with courtesy. Derogatory or sarcastic comments are inappropriate.
The public will likewise be encouraged by the Mayor to maintain meeting decorum.
In Council meetings when citizens are agitated, the Mayor may call a short recess to calm the situation.
If a member of the public is unable to attend the Council meeting, written communications may be sent to the City Clerk by e-mail or by regular mail. Communications received after distribution of the agenda packet will be made available to the Council at/or as soon after the meeting.
Linda commented as follows:
• I would like to say the speakers are eloquent
• Recommend letters to the Press Democrat and also, the bohemian. • That would be effective in getting a wider audience for speech. • Your buddy Dante is dead set on installing the wireless water meters on the 16th of February. • Those things fail, which they will.
• If they ever get installed. That is on you.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
• You're the one who trusted him and I want you to be able to take responsibility for you leading us down this path of death of $2 million.
• Discussed the wireless microwave transmitters in front of our homes. They're transmitting microwave radiation to our children and our animals, the birds and the bees, ourselves. • Just continue to watch our medical emergencies to soar and not to mention, the cancer right. • That is on you. Take responsibility I hope you resign.
CITY COUNCIL/CITY STAFF REPORTS/COMMUNICATIONS/ANNOUNCEMENTS/FUTURE MEETINGS:
16. City Manager-Attorney/City Clerk Reports: (This will be either verbal or written reports provided at or prior to the meeting). Due to the lateness of the hour, City staff commented the following information is posted to the City web site.
Parklets
1. GHD team presented the preliminary draft parklets guidelines to the Design Guidelines subcommittee on January 26. The meeting was very productive and the subcommittee requested that they have an opportunity to review the revised draft before it is presented to the Planning Commission. To accommodate this request, the schedule will be delayed by about a month but we believe the added meeting (tentatively scheduled the week of February 20) will result in a better guidelines document.
Rather than this item going to Council on March 7, the guidelines will likely be presented to Council in April.
2. As a reminder, the original schedule was being pushed because of needing to meet Caltrans’ timeframe for having a design for the encroachment permit for the South Main parklet. However, we’ve heard that Caltrans’ schedule for developing their final set of requirements for permanent parklets has been delayed so the City will have some additional time before finalizing its encroachment permit for the South Main Street parklet.
3. On a separate but related item, the City Engineer has been in discussion with Caltrans right of way staff regarding the City’s desire to acquire the triangle piece where the Depot Street temporary parklet was previously located. Caltrans staff made it clear that the triangle piece at Petaluma Avenue/Depot Street would be considered but that it can only be used for general public use. They would also look more favorably to the relinquishment of the right of way if it related in some way to transportation purposes.
The next step is for the City to submit a letter to Caltrans making a formal request and describing what use, including transportation purposes, is envisioned for the triangle piece. Staff will be bringing this matter for discussion to Council at a future meeting.
Ives Park Pathway Replacement Project
1. The plans and specs have been completed by RHAA Landscape Architects and a copy can be found on the City’s website when the project is bid later this month.
2. The cost estimate for the construction work is under the $200,000 threshold which means by State law and City purchasing policy, the project can follow the State’s informal bid process and does not need Council approval for authorization to bid and is under the purview of the City Manager.
Bodega Avenue Bike Lanes and Rehab Phase 1 Project (High Street to Robinson Road)
1. The City received final approval from Caltrans who is administering this federal-aid transportation grant project.
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
2. This project received a grant of $1.2 million dollars and with this final approval, the City is authorized to move forward to bid the project.
3. Staff will be requesting authorization to bid the project at the next Council meeting.
Bodega Avenue Bike Lanes and Rehab Phase 2 Project (Robinson Road to Pleasant Hill Road)
1. The City received good news that it has been awarded a Go Sonoma transportation grant for the Phase 2 project.
2. The allocated grant fund is for $2.24 million. The funds will be available for the City’s use in Fiscal Year 2024/25.
Sustainable Transportation Planning Grant
1. W Trans is currently preparing the grant application.
2. The draft application will be presented to the Planning Commission for their input at the February 14 meeting.
3. The deadline date for the grant application to Caltrans is March 9, 2023.
Zimpher Creek Sewer Relocation Part 1 - Covert Lane Rerouting
1. The plans and specs are underway and to be completed by GHD for bidding in late February with construction work anticipated to start in spring. The work consists of approximately 250 feet of new 8- inch sewer main from Covert Avenue to Healdsburg Avenue and will reduce the sewer flows in the portion of sewer main in Zimpher Creek.
2. This work is the initial phase of the overall project that will benefit the Zimpher Creek with ultimately relocating the sewer main away from the creek bed and avoid potential sewer overflows to the creek and surrounding area.
17. City Council Reports/Committee/Sub-Committee Meeting Reports: (Reports by Mayor/City Councilmembers Regarding Various Agency Meetings/Committee Meetings/Sub-Committee Meeting /Conferences Attended and Possible Direction to its Representatives (If Needed) on Pending issues before such Boards)
(This will be either verbal or written reports provided at the meeting) GC section 53232.3 (d) requires members of a legislative body to provide brief reports on meetings attended at the expense of the local agency at the next regular meeting of the body. A report out will be provided by those who attended the League of CA Cities/CAL Cities Conference Attendees: Mayor Hinton; Vice Mayor Rich; Councilmember Maurer and Councilmember Zollman
18. Council Communications Received (Information/Meetings/Correspondence Received from the General Public to Councilmembers)
19. Future City Meeting Dates/Events (Informational Only): (See City Web Site for Up-to-Date Meeting Dates/Times)
CLOSED SESSION: NONE
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023
ADJOURNMENT OF CITY COUNCIL MEETING
February 7, 2023 Meeting will be adjourned to the City Council Meeting to be held February 21, 2023 at 6:00 pm.
Vice Mayor Rich adjourned the February 7, 2023 City Council Regular Meeting at 12:03 am (February 8, 2023) to the Next Regular Scheduled City Council Meeting of February 21, 2023, Zoom Virtual Meeting Format.
Respectfully Submitted,
Mary Gourley
Assistant City Manager/Attorney/City Clerk
Agenda Item Number: 2
Agenda Item Number: 2
City Council Meeting Packet of: February 21, 2023